- So this is the Economic Development Commission meeting of St. Patrick's Day, March 17th, 2026.
- And it's 4 PM. And we're in person at City Hall in the McCloskey Conference Room. And the meeting has
- been appropriately posted and noticed. Correct, Jane? Yes? OK. Lisa, how are you? Hello.
- We have four of our five members here. Come on. There we go. We should do something. That's right. So
- why don't we go around and do a roll call on Kurt Zorn. I'm Liz Spital. I'm Isak Asari. Tim Hankey.
- Jane Cooper Smith, staff. Roll call. Great. Great. And we have minutes from I think it's the October 24th.
- I'm sorry, 21st meeting. Any comments, corrections, changes? I didn't see anything. If not, can we move?
- I will move approval. Second, I'd like to discuss it real fast. Sure. Yeah, go ahead. Just a question
- for Jane. Why don't we get a second first and then we'll discuss it. Second. There we go. I'm just curious
- about the format. It seemed different. Of the minutes? Yeah.
- Quite a bit of commissioners said this, or commissioners thought that. Oh, you know what? We have a
- new intern taking, right, Dee? Do you think that's related to having a new person? No. That realization
- was really dense, and because we don't do this often, I wanted to make sure that the minutes were pretty
- detailed, because I thought there was some good information in there.
- I mean, normally, I don't usually do that much depth, but it was something that I think that we can
- refer to later, looking back on this. So I thought that it was useful. I can make sure to not do that.
- I'm not being critical. It's just different and different than what I'm used to. That's all.
- Very informative. So we've got a motion to second. Any more comments?
- If not, can I ask one other question? Yeah, please. So D, do you think that it'll return to more summary?
- So with the minute, D and I have actually talked about this a bunch, but the minutes can be in the form
- of a memo summarizing, or they can be at this level of detail. So I guess, yeah, Isaac. I like about this.
- I like the detail with that. Particularly because we haven't met in a long time. Refreshes. Yes.
- And it's, I think, really helpful when we're talking about substantive things. I think there's a time
- when you want to just be like, OK, they talked and they moved on. But we have substantive that we didn't
- make a whole lot of decisions. It was helpful because we had substantive briefings and discussions on
- a lot of things. I think it's really helpful to have that trail to be able to see. Kurt said something wise.
- Oh. Everybody was astounded. That might be a little too much detail. That's right. That's exactly right.
- All right. Well, I think Dee and Jane will take that into consideration as they do minutes going forward.
- Any other comments? If not, all in favor, please say aye.
- Hi. Anybody opposed? Passes, isn't it? Yeah. It's easy for me to say. Passes unanimously. And then we
- have new business, which is election of officers. I would like to propose that that Kurt Zorn be elected
- our president. Just in case I say something.
- And why? I think you're doing a great job, and we would like you to maintain doing a great job. I think
- there's people in the waiting room, also. Oh, gosh. But I think that, you know, unless somebody is like,
- wow, I really want to do this. No, I'm all in favor. We appreciate your leadership. Oh, there's Vanessa.
- There's Vanessa. Goodness. Well, let's wait for a second until Vanessa. Everyone's AI.
- versions of themselves. They're here too. So Vanessa, I notice you have joined. Yes, I have. Hello,
- everyone. Hi, I'm Vanessa. We already did approval of minutes. We're on new business election of officers,
- and ESAC was just starting.
- So we had just made you president. Congratulations. I know, but it's not a true statement. Yeah, I think,
- Kurt, you've done such an awesome job at leading this commission, and I think work so closely with EDC
- already, I think it just makes a lot of sense. I'll thank it.
- in the second then. Do you want to do a whole slate or just one? Do one at a time. I mean, I'm fine
- with it either way. Tim, you want to be vice president? I would like to continue the slate that we have.
- We've just barely got any momentum. That's right. I'll look at that. What was the slate?
- It's not the guy. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G.
- It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G.
- It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G. It's my G.
- Yeah, here we go. This detail might be nice to have recorded somewhere. Exactly. I think we do from
- last year. Sorry, I'm just having trouble putting my hand up on this. Dee, can you look that up in the
- February onboard minutes for EDC, the slate of officers?
- I'm actually looking for it right now. It's just my computer running a little slow. So I will get that.
- Well, we have a motion and a second. Right. Yeah, to keep the slate as it is, whatever that slate is.
- Yeah, we second. Yeah, some motion and a second. Well, any discussion? The officers have done a wonderful
- job. Yeah.
- I do think something we should consider, and I know, like all jokes aside, one of the things that we've
- been trying to think about is how we better use the EDC as a proactive advisory body. And so I don't
- think any of us care what we're called, but none of us here. But I do think that that should be the
- sort of charge here is saying, let's move beyond having lovely meetings every so often. It seems silly
- to change officers when we really have
- Okay. That might be a nice moment to describe what Kurt and I had talked about for this year was a little
- bit of a different rhythm, but maybe that's for a different subject or a different agenda. Oh no, not
- the new chairs. We have a motion on the floor. Any discussion about the slate?
- And then we can move to yours, Jane, after that. Yeah. OK. So all in favor? Aye. Aye. Anybody opposed?
- OK. Vanessa, we've got a thumbnail. So just so you know what you guys signed up for, it's Kurt, Esauk
- as vice president and Vanessa as secretary. Great. Great. Esauk didn't have enough to do, so we just
- figured it would be him.
- Yeah, give me actually something to do or this would be great. All right. So old business, Jane, you
- want to talk a little bit about what? Well, this agenda. This is new business. Yeah, I put this agenda
- together, not realizing it doesn't have. We should have done old business first and new business second,
- I think. Good job, Chris. We can put that around.
- Well, I wanted to give you guys a little, it's almost like a staff report, if I could just update you
- on a few different goings on. And then one of those items is that, Kurt and I, I don't know how you
- still feel favorably toward this, but we talked a little bit about the meeting cadence in the last year
- and how the EDC doesn't have business all the time and it's kind of random. When we do have business,
- it's just not predictable. We wondered about,
- meeting, retaining our monthly meeting times in case we have business come up, but having substantive
- meetings quarterly where we are focused on digging into a little bit more substantive issues. We can
- do it that way or we can just keep going month by month, meeting by meeting as we have been, but we
- just sort of wondered about that.
- So what is the chart? Is there anything officially written about when the commission is supposed to
- meet? I don't believe so. No? I mean, I've been on the commission for a number of years, and there have
- been years we've met only once. Because we're not a regulatory body, right? So we don't have to meet.
- No, but there may be something that is posted somewhere to talk about how often you meet. I'll have
- legal do a review.
- Yeah. To see. I think as long as there's nothing in conflict with what we're supposed to be doing, I
- think it's fine. But I would recommend that you all keep the monthly appointments on your calendar in
- case we have something urgent. Because you want to be nimble if something comes up. Yeah. You have to
- wait until the quarterly meeting. Yeah, exactly. I agree. OK.
- That's that. So just there are a few items. It really wouldn't change an awful lot, because right now,
- Jane or Dee say, they usually text me and say, we have something for the meeting, or we don't have something
- for the meeting. It's all right to cancel. And I say, yes. So we'll still do the same thing. We'll still
- send a notice out saying, we're not going to be meeting. Yeah. Right? Yeah. But we will meet on those
- quarterly. And we establish what those quarterly months are.
- certainly can do that. Yeah. I mean, my goal was to have us meet January, the first month of each quarter.
- But then I can't remember what happened in January and February, but I think we had a storm and then
- I had to get out of town kind of urgently. And then you were available in February. I think that's the
- case. So now we're meeting in March. So we could do the third month, but we'll always really want to
- do the organizing. Well, we could still do January and we could just
- April because we're having this March meeting. Yeah, and then we'll have. Of course it's a lot of good
- month. We'll have tax abatement reporting. In June. In June. Right. So maybe the plan is folly. I'm
- lost when we're meeting. Can somebody. No, we're just, we're thinking, we're talking out loud. Okay,
- okay. Kind of thinking out loud. Yeah, really quick. So for second quarter, the best
- would be the end of May because tax abatement presentation to the council is June 10th. So we would
- need to meet in May because it needs to be reviewed by the EDC before it goes to council. And the EDC
- meets on May 19th. So keep that May meeting.
- Does that mean that quarterly doesn't really work for us? I think so. Because you really want to meet
- in January to organize. Yeah. Maybe we'll just have once or twice a year with staffs help almost like
- a retreat meeting where we're talking bigger. Big issues. Yeah. Yeah. OK. All right. And we'll try to
- figure out what works best.
- July meeting is probably not a good time to have that because people have Tennessee. Right. Well, I
- still appreciate this conversation and just, I don't know. So are we keeping April 21st as a possible?
- Keep it on your calendar just in case. We're keeping all the dates as possible. We're definitely going
- to meet in May. And maybe that's what we do. When we get to that next meeting that we know we're meeting,
- we decide if there's a next
- date to have a definite meeting regardless of what's on the agenda. But you'll let us know if something
- comes up on the 21st, we need to meet for April. We'll let you know when it comes. Just keep it on the
- calendar. But you'll let us know both ways. Yes. Okay, great. Yes. Thank you. So just running through
- my list of staff things. One item I just wanted to maybe raise
- is that I've been attending quarterly meetings with MCCSC, their business roundtable meetings. ESOC's
- been there too. They're super informative. And I think there's a big opportunity to try to support MCCSC
- in the coming months and indefinitely. One of the ways that their activities are shifting a little bit
- is with the new degree requirements and the workplace
- degree requirements for students. So a lot of students will be entering into internships and coming
- into workplaces across the community. So I'm not exactly sure how the EDC can lift that up, but I wanted
- to share that information. Is this news? It is news. Yeah. Sorry, I don't have my... So where are those
- degrees? So now within Indiana, there are essentially
- Essentially two, there's really three tracks that all students have to go through to get their diplomas.
- One of them is sort of built more towards the idea of them going into things like apprenticeships. And
- then the other is sort of the university track, if you will, and there's like an honors track within
- both of those. But the... And there's the military track. And the military track, yeah. Is that in addition
- to the other three you just mentioned? Yeah, so I think, yeah, so the big changes that regardless...
- Where does the military fall into? Sorry, there's workforce, college, military. Yeah. Okay.
- Thank you. The main framework that's changing is that they all have a, and differing, but they all have
- an element of workforce within the diploma. So even people who are going to sort of, you know,
- the traditional route, if you will, are still required to get some type of a job placement during their
- time in school. And it's differing hours, depending on what that is. But, you know, I think it works
- out to like,
- I mean, they need to work like 10 hours a week or something like that. Like, it's not an insignificant
- amount of time. But any job during has to be any job with you. When does it become effective? I've read
- about it before. I think it is effective. Like, yeah, I think the current students have that requirement.
- My son is a freshman, and they're the first class that will graduate under the new requirements. So
- I think just, I don't know if that's just an FYI.
- And we can follow up more on opportunities to support and I think there's, you know, and Dr. Winston
- is at the last meeting is sort of said that she's putting together this subcommittee with a broad idea of.
- you know, trying to reframe what that question is to begin with. I think, you know, Jane and I have
- been on this committee with a lot of other people in the community for now the last, it feels like a
- year and a half. It started off with a question that was something like, well, how do we place all these
- students? Okay. I mean, it's an interesting question, but so everybody comes around and goes, I have
- two placements and I have three. Okay, that's great.
- But if you change the tact and say, how do we make this a driver of economic development and innovation,
- et cetera, that we actually can match pain points and gain points within the community, that's a more
- interesting question. I think that that's really now where she's trying to think is about, could we
- use this opportunity to meet some type of needs in the community in some sustained way? So. And to that
- end, this is
- Sorry, I write my notes throughout the month for what I want to share with you guys and I didn't have
- these details in. So MCCSE is putting together an advisory council that will have about 40 community
- members. They want different types of backgrounds, different types of expertise, different types of
- lived experience. The council's called Strong Schools, Strong Community. There's an application available
- online for this and so I think I'll just say you could google strong schools strong community advisory
- council or email me at jane.coopersmith at bloomington.in.gov. Is there enough jobs to fill all these
- people having jobs? Well it'll be addressed in a number of ways and you know regional opportunity initiatives
- with their ready schools program is doing a lot of work with apprenticeship activities and
- there will be ways that some internships not in person will count toward the work requirement. So I
- think they're being very creative and also practical about how they can meet the requirements. Transportation
- is a huge barrier for a lot of students. So yeah. Emergent strategy, as they say. And what are the penalties
- if you can't make this happen?
- I don't know. Yeah. Is this only for one year? These are the degree requirements now. But your work
- requirement? Freshman, sophomore, junior, and senior? It looks different each year. He doesn't,
- for example, have a work requirement this year. So I think it's maybe more upperclassmen, weighted toward
- upperclassmen. But I think if a student's on the
- If a student is on the workforce track, they might have some kind of workplace requirement early on.
- And that could be maybe getting a certification of some kind, or I don't know. We had a bunch of students
- a week ago from Hoosier Hills Career Center visit the city and visit different city facilities to learn
- about working here. I'm not sure if that was part of it or not.
- I feel like I'm way off in the weeds, but. 75 approved work hours is the baseline. Cool. What kind of
- time period? Over the time that they're in high school. Four years. The whole high school? Correct.
- 75. 75 hours? Yeah. Oh, jeez. It's not that all that much. Yeah, right. But then the employment honors
- seal requires 150 hours, while others require 650. Which the 650 is, I assume, what do you call it,
- the workforce one.
- Where did the 10 hours a week come in? I was guessing. Oh, okay. So that's how I remembered it. Okay.
- So that doesn't quite add up if you have 75 the whole time, right? Yeah, exactly. Okay. Anything else
- on that item? Do you want to be kept apprised of that or if there are others? I mean, I think it's just
- nice to bring MCCSE items to the group, I guess, when they're
- information to share. So how are these things legitimized? How do you prove that you're doing this?
- Who do you report this to, I guess, is the question. That they're doing this, right? The student. The
- workplace experiences are all managed by the school. OK. Yeah. So they track that something is turned
- into the school, and they track it, and all that. Exactly. Thank you. Yeah. One other thing I wanted
- to mention. I mean, I'll just make a comment. Go ahead.
- It's a nice idea, conceptionally. It's going to be a bear, especially to have every student do it. Yeah,
- it's a state requirement. No, no, I understand that. But I'm just going to say it. It's an unfunded
- mandate, because it's going to cause a lot of administrative work for MCCSE to track these. I know this
- from my experience with students who are undergraduates.
- who have to get internships towards their undergraduate degree. It's huge. And we're talking about lots
- of students. Again, conception is a great idea. But as is the case with a number of things that the
- state mandates, it's probably not thought through as carefully as it needs to be. So I hope MCCSE can be.
- and this sounds like they are being created. But that's, I think, where the broader community comes
- in, where it's like, you know, I mean, we could just approach this from the lens of, you know, most
- of them will end up shadowing somebody, and that counts as their time. I think that we should be creative
- in creating opportunities to receive them that are meaningful, you know? That's the other point, making
- sure it's meaningful.
- To the community right obviously there's the it will be meaningful to the to the students just just
- by virtue of the exposure look at the experience they'll get but how do we make sure that it's meaningful
- to the to the community you know I mean you know we we I think as a city could think about a lot of
- ways that you know I mean.
- Maybe that's how Kirkwood is really exciting. I don't know. But you can think about a lot of different
- things that maybe they staff council's office. We need like thousands of people to staff council office,
- for example. So thinking about ways that you actually can create lots of productivity, innovation,
- et cetera. While also, I think it also for us in the long term of our view, how do we then connect
- young people who have grown up here to industry here so that they think about staying here or coming
- back here when it's relevant. Yeah, it's funny because I agree with both Kurt and Isak because, yeah,
- this is a total beast for sure. And to try and implement it so quickly is just a bad decision. However, this is
- This is what we think of it. And I do think that this is a good element for recidivism. I think that
- this will really, if we can get small business owners, not to just think of the bigger companies,
- but small, mainstream businesses, people going from a micro enterprise or a main street, those people
- getting connected and making those apprenticeships and things like that,
- that's a really strong, like, emotional connection. And I think that's one of the things we're kind
- of missing with keeping young people here, a strong emotional connection, and having that communication,
- intergenerational communication as well. So, you know, this is, this, you know, we've got to make lemonade
- out of the lemons that we got right now and utilize this to get kids connected to the city park. Because
- the wood meringue is a great
- thing to have. It would be great if these kids are going to go off for like a year and come back and
- bring back all their experience. So yeah, but I 100% to your point, but this is a great opportunity
- for us. Next item I wanted to just give you guys a heads up on is that the Opportunity Zones last year
- were made permanent. The Opportunity Zone program, which is
- Certain census tracts are eligible to be named opportunity zones. Investments within qualified opportunity
- funds in those opportunity zones are able to be shielded from capital gains taxes. So it's an effort
- from the Trump administration to continue this program that really tries to leverage private partnership
- in community goods. So they're low income census tracts.
- The previous round of OZs was created in 2016 and it was a 10 year program and then it rolled off. So
- there was a lot of activity early on and not a lot in the second half of it because the administrative
- burden was so high. But now these programs are made permanent. The next step for Bloomington is to identify
- what the new operating
- opportunity zones will be and seek approval on those from the governor's office. So we're just in the
- process of doing that and are working with a state lobbying organization and with our partners at regional
- opportunity initiatives because we want to be thinking about the region as a whole and not just Bloomington
- as an island. So I'm optimistic that we have some good eligible census tracts. There are some ineligible
- tracks that were eligible and are no longer eligible, which is unfortunate. But one of the tracks, so
- all of Hopewell, if we can get that approved, we'll be in the new one, or we'll lobby for that. And
- so that's one incentive that the Trump administration made permanent. They also made permanent new markets
- tax credits. We haven't had a lot of activity in that area in Bloomington, but I also think that could
- show up in Hopewell.
- So mentioning those two things and then transitioning maybe to Seminary Square for a moment and the
- properties surrounding it. There was a headline maybe a month ago at this point that property owners
- surrounding Seminary Square lobbied the assessor and the assessor reduced the assessed value of those
- properties by a certain percentage. And I don't know, I don't have that math off the back of the
- But I've been thinking a lot about seminary in that area. It comes up a lot as we're working on Hopewell
- development and we're looking toward the Convention Center development. And so I'd like to be able to
- at least assemble the suite of existing incentives around that area to be able to communicate about
- them in anticipation of some turnover starting to happen in that area or fostering that turnover.
- So Opportunity Zones would be one. We have the Enterprise Zone. That property falls in the Enterprise
- Zone. But I wanted to bring it up here just to kind of see if the commissioners are tracking
- that conversation. Last year, you were really helpful when I said, hey, I'm working on these things.
- And you all kind of responded, well, that's nice, but focus on the stuff over here. So I think it,
- I mean, it's.
- bordering on blight, and seem to be in our wheelhouse and try to put together some incentives to improve
- it. And it's well known by the community. Yeah. Very physical. Very physical. A lot of traffic. Just
- driving for miles today. Yeah. And it affects all of downtown. I've heard people say that, especially
- in the summertime,
- you are students, the proportion of what you see when you drive into downtown is less favorable. And
- you just don't feel like staying. I mean, some people just, it's somewhat depressing, of course, because
- there are people that are in bad shape, down on their luck. Yeah. Yeah. And I think just having this
- conversation, it's not even,
- anti, the humans who are experiencing the challenges that they're experiencing and hanging out in that
- area. It's really looking at the business loss around the area, which is contributing to a vacuum. We
- just need more activity. Well, I just got appointed to the property tax assessment board of appeals.
- I had to make sure I got it correct. And Judy Sharp, the assessor, talked
- some about this, and it's the land value that's been reduced. And again, I don't remember the percentage,
- but it was a substantial amount, substantial amount, because land prices are pretty high in Bloomington.
- So of course, the assessed value becomes pretty high, which then becomes a disincentive for investment.
- So I think it's a good way to get started, but the incentives along with that
- is what's going to be needed. You need more than just the reduction of the assessed value. On the subject
- of reduced AV, do you all feel like this is something that should be considered for maybe a short abatement
- program or a percentage abatement program? Yeah, it's really targeted. I think the assessor told me
- we're at 52% tax exempt.
- 52% of our properties are tax exempt in Bloomington, which makes abatements just really a difficult
- incentive for us to consider. However, if the property values are being reduced all by themselves and
- they're not being redeveloped, then I wonder if it is something. And tax abatements reduce future taxes.
- They don't reduce today's taxes.
- So if you're incentivizing something new, you're still getting more taxes than you would have otherwise.
- So I think it's a good tool to use here. Who would be doing the tax evasion? I mean, who would approve
- those? What body? It would be the city council. The EDC typically makes a recommendation to the city
- council. And then the city council has the ability to approve or deny.
- tax abatement. Sorry it's all because it's a city of Bloomington property it's all within the and then
- we notify the assessor. So we're talking about the city of Bloomington property. Property that's in
- the city of Bloomington. Okay so it's not city of Bloomington property? No. Private property within
- city limits. So where do those people pay their tax bill at?
- Well, they all pay to the county, and then the money is dispersed to the jurisdictions. Yeah. So some
- of that goes to school. I'm familiar with that. Right, right. No, of course. So if we have an abatement
- in a piece of property in Bloomington, the city proper, that basically is borne by the rest of the taxpayers.
- Everybody else pays that. That's right. That's right. I get that. And all the different, I think,
- All the different taxing elements will also be affected because we're not just debating city taxes,
- but there's a state legislation that defines the entire process and what we can debate for. But if the
- city council approves it and goes through the process and meets those requirements,
- then the library gets less money, the schools get less money, and the county gets less money,
- and so on. But it's pretty narrow in how it can be used because it has such a big impact. So give me
- an example of a current property in the city that is abated. We have abatements at a number of affordable
- housing developments.
- And then we have a number of employment-related abatements at the Novo Nordisk site, because they've
- put up such large job numbers. But we really don't have a ton of them. And then last year, we did a
- pilot agreement, which is a version of an abatement, where it makes the amount payable predictable.
- And I think this just makes sense that these questions are coming from you, because this is
- why you are here, you're representing the county council because this has impact on your jurisdiction.
- I would suggest that maybe we ought to have a conversation with the county assessor to see how city
- tax abatements might be used to achieve the same thing she's trying to do with reducing this. I think
- it'd be worthwhile to review what can be abated because
- You know, it's pretty narrow. I mean, it's housing and jobs. And I don't know. I mean, it's kind of
- hard to target jobs, especially. I mean, you have to talk to an employer and go in there and hire people
- or somebody that's already there, increase their hiring. Yeah, there's certain metrics that are usually
- outlayed, right? Yeah. And housing. Is that limited by state code? I think so. We have our.
- The state code sets of the broad parameters, and then we have our local criteria. Local ordinance. And
- our local criteria talk about affordable housing, job creation, and then I think there's a community
- character bucket. Is that code, or is that policy of EDC? That's an EDC policy. Right. So I say that
- because I do think that that's worth exploring. Yeah, I do wonder. I thought it was an ordinance. I
- don't think so.
- Let me check. You don't check. I'll check so you don't. You're doing too many things at once. Yeah,
- I don't think it's a ordinance. Evaluating criteria are what I'm thinking of. Yeah. OK. But for us,
- I would love to hear what incentives could be applied to an area that we consider blighted. And then
- we could then, I think, because I'm not sure that a basement's going to
- Abatement could be one. But Tim, good point. See where we have right now. And if we have the flexibility,
- we may change it a little bit. Because I think a stall furniture, the example, they moved to the west
- side because of the... It's a really good example. Is there something we can do to retain a business
- there through a property tax abatement? Will the state law allow us? And then we might have to change
- our criteria
- to broaden it a little bit, to do some retention as opposed to just creation. So if we look at the tools
- that we think we have available, let's see if they work or if they could be. Whether we do some things
- that. Because I really don't know, other than some familiar with familiarity with the big man. Yeah.
- Also, what would be, like what's, I think it's a really good opportunity to think
- like the ways that people often think about like a redevelopment zone, right? Like what's the, what's
- like a right anchor for that place so that we also are targeted about the strategy that it's not just,
- we just want some business here, but it's what do we want? And I think that's what's really nice, nice,
- wrong word. I think that's the opportunity because we're basically blank slate. I mean, there's a post office.
- No, like what else is there anymore? I mean, the Thai restaurant, I guess. World food market. And there's
- rallies still there. And then we're about to have Hopewell. I mean, so there's also a thought about
- when you have Hopewell developing, does that negate the need for sort of focused tax abatement there?
- Do people gravitate toward the development already? My perception is it's related to time. And the abatement
- is like an accelerant for that area. Otherwise, you're waiting for it, which might be fine.
- I don't know. And I think on the retention piece, I just want to mention that
- I don't have official news, but I just think it's really important that we retain Kroger in that location.
- Kroger, having a full grocery store there is what supports the neighborhood of Hopewell, it supports
- the existing neighbors. It helps a big, big neighborhood. Yeah, so I don't know, just observing that.
- Am I misinformed, but that there's some type of, like that Kroger is like the Kroger that has the most?
- It has the most something, I forget what it was. Yeah, like the most,
- In their national croaker, I think that the statistic I remember being told was something like, it has
- the most lost goods or something to that extent. Is that true? I haven't heard that, but I just can't
- comment. I don't know. But I know that they put a lot of effort behind loss prevention and security
- guards hired. That's interesting. Yeah. OK.
- I think a really good point that you bring up, to look ahead and to make sure that they stay, because
- that would be a major, that would hit Hopa, would hit Prospect Hill, it would hit the New West Side.
- Yes, and the way that corporation is managing site control is not, it doesn't mean that another grocery
- could just come into that location. Exactly.
- Okay, that's helpful. If you don't mind, I'll switch gears to another incentive that was just approved.
- SB 89 was approved. Sorry, I don't have the title for it. Let me look it up. Oh, that's a bad website.
- Well, it's to expand alcohol permits. So I just, we had some discussion last fall. Um, I'm sorry, I
- don't have the, I'm not getting a good hit on the bill text right now, but, um, this, the state has
- issued a number of additional three-way permits for different, um, communities across Indiana and they've
- allocated two additional permits for Bloomington.
- And so I think that's validating in a way. I think it means the state understands the utility of these
- permits as a tool, as an economic development tool. There's specific economic development language in
- the legislation. And so there are a few next steps before they can be activated. There has to be qualifying.
- Qualifications have to be identified.
- Um, and ESOC, I'm not sure if this is on a staff level or if council has to do it, but we have to determine
- who qualifies for these permits. Um, and then there's a second step, which is entering into a commitment
- agreement with the recipient of those permits. So I think there are a number of layers where, um, it
- will ultimately be a staff recommendation of some sort. We'll get to determine what our, what are our
- priorities for these permits. These are useful tools. They will, they're different than,
- the ones that were discussed last fall in that these are full three-way permits. They cost $40,000 each.
- I don't know that they are retained as long-term assets. That's unclear to me at this time. So the current-
- They revert back to the city. They revert back to the state, I think. Is that right? Like after the
- person who's given it, but then the city still retains the ability to give it to somebody else? Yeah,
- exactly. And what I don't understand is,
- If they say a business is granted in one of the three ways, they enter into the commitment agreement,
- but they don't meet those commitments, then the city can say, hey, ATC, we need you to enforce this.
- We no longer support this business having it. It reverts to the state. But I don't know if that means
- that their $40,000 investment is gone.
- So there's a lot more to learn about, but I just wanted to flag it. I think it's a good thing. The EDC
- won't have a formal role, but I just wanted to mention it since this came up for us last year. If it's
- OK that I say, I mean, if it hadn't been for the fact that I was serving as council staff at the moment,
- my intention, and I think building off the conversation that we had that was just in our memo here,
- My intention was, I do think it would make a lot of sense, and this is following after Valparaiso, they
- had a council action that sort of just said, this is how we decide any type of permits that we're going
- to be deciding. And I think it would be great for us to have one piece of legislation that basically
- says, you have the SB 89 ones, you have the ones that would be riverfront district if we ever have one,
- we have the ones that would be for the historic downtown. So we just set out all of that criteria.
- And whether we give those or not, different story. But I just think if you set the criteria, it will
- get some motion there a lot clearer. So I would love, in short, I have every intention of writing that
- legislation. I think it would be really wonderful to have a discussion here to think about what that
- really should look like. Like, what are the priorities? Yeah. What are our priorities? Do we want local-owned
- businesses? How are we going to determine all of those type of things, I think, would be. Yeah.
- So is that something that you would want to have us put on an agenda? I would love that. I would love
- that. For all of the things like that? I think that's the best approach, but I might be wrong. I will
- say it makes me a little nervous just because I think the response to the discussions earlier on this
- year, or in 2025, the public was very
- leery of even having the conversations. And so I think there's just a lot of education that needs to
- happen. So on one hand, I could see it as a good opportunity to air out that topic and provide some
- visibility into it. On the other hand, I think, well, if it's just for SB 89, maybe you just start with
- that. I think what's nice is that because SB 89 is going to happen, it's happened, right?
- it gives the opportunity to say, this is the impetus for which you do this. And so you have to build
- the governance capacity to do it. And so it's like, but I just think it sets it in the right tone. So
- the conversation isn't like, we're just trying to get all these alcohol permits out into the community.
- It's about we're thinking responsibly about one of the tools for economic development. And we're thinking
- before we even have to do it, we're already making some rules so that everybody can contribute to making
- those rules.
- So that was all I had on SB 89, unless there's more on that one. I had one other item I just wanted
- to update you on. Is that OK to keep going? Sure. I wanted to let you know that David Hiddle, our planning
- director, is working on. I mean, there are a number of, I think, UDO updates in process, and of course,
- We're all concerned first and foremost about housing. But I did want to let you know that he's also
- working on what he's calling the small business omnibus updates to the UDO. And we think those will
- go forward maybe in the fall, early fall. He's doing business outreach now and talking to, I'm trying
- to connect him with businesses that have failed to start in Bloomington because of onerous UDO requirements.
- So sharing this with you in response to comments that you've made where we were talking about, you know,
- something or other and you were like, well, you know, if you want to move the needle for Bloomington,
- you really got to focus on that. So D and I are supporting that effort, but it's definitely being led
- and managed by planning. Is the city utility involved?
- I don't think so, but I can, I'll take that note. I think they're a significant part of the problem.
- The utility. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I've just made a note to share that. Do you do some of the state of the
- permitting audit?
- Is that done, and will action be taken there? Because I think that that's the speed to getting things
- approved often. Yeah. I apologize. My recall is really bad. There was an update yesterday, and I think
- I was answering email, so I don't have the full update. But I know it's moving along, and I know I just
- heard that the county is moving to the same permitting
- and licensing system that the city uses. So we think that will just provide an efficiency and
- more transparency. So positive development. But I can report back on the status of the audit. And that's
- it. Those were the items I just wanted to share. No actions. Based on the hands we talked about, it
- sounds like we have some things to do this year. Yeah.
- Maybe we will be meeting every Monday. I do think this group could participate in David Hittle's project.
- I mean, that's economic development. Yes. And so I don't know how you want us to participate. Well,
- if you assemble, then it's got to be in the form of a public meeting. But we could invite him to a meeting.
- Or you could. I would like that. I could invite him to our next meeting. I could also connect you.
- with him so you could schedule one-on-one time? I think it's a good idea. I'd do it. It's interesting.
- Maybe you can do that before the next meeting and have him come and lead the conversation. There's a
- tie between this subject and your first subject about the tax
- reduction and the blight. You remember in that article that you talked about? One of the property owners
- down there said that all they're doing is getting grief about the size of their landscape rocks. That's
- David Hiddles' department. Yes. I mean, he's tracking that. That was embarrassing. Right. Well, there's
- always two or more sites to every story.
- So maybe you could talk to David before the meeting. Yeah, I'll send an email. Maybe Jane, you and I
- could talk with the assistant. I'd like that. Looking great. We'll let you off.
- Well, I'll work on this legislation because I really think if I could get it before the next time, it
- would be good to have that on the agenda to just get comments on it. So are you or somebody going to
- work with Judy? Yeah, he's taking that. Jay and I are going to talk with Judy and see if there's something
- the city and the county can do together. That's great. I don't know. Was that general discussion?
- So I think, yeah, I think that was general discussion. I'm not really sure. Maybe I'll add a staff report
- item to our next agenda. So I can kind of just. No, but deep into the process have concluded round one.
- interviews for the special projects manager position. We had 103 applicants for that. Closed on Sunday
- night, the assistant director for the arts position and had, I think, 53 applicants for that. But that's
- a narrower, you know, it's a pretty specific skill set. Special project was a part-time job or a full-time
- job? Full-time. Maybe we should think about how we could, you know,
- We need an administration person and council, so maybe we can call through that and see if people are
- interested. Oh, see who looks good from that. Well, there are a lot of applicants that have more general
- administrative experience than this job has a lot of doing and art implementation. Yeah, I actually
- think that's a good idea is to put a regular staff report. Being the finance authority I serve on, at
- the end of each meeting,
- the finance director of the state gives a report. Sometimes it's just two or three words, sometimes
- it's more detailed to sort of give you an idea of what's brewing. And the other thing is let's put old
- business before new business. Vanessa, you have anything you want to add? Okay.
- It takes a minute to unmute. Sorry. No, I don't have anything to add. Thank you. Thank you. We have
- a couple people in the house. Do you have anything you want to bring in front of before we talk? I think
- to the point of everybody, what I just heard in my short time listening here, that this is where things
- start in regards to trying to rebuild some of our economic infrastructure that needs to occur.
- our tax base and our wages up. Everybody needs to work collaboratively to do it within the city, the
- economic development commissions, RDC, council in order to build things up. Because when we hear the
- things that have happened in the south moment, it drops our property taxes. It also drops what's able
- to be done for the community. It drops our assessments. Yes. I'm not sure it drops our property taxes.
- No, it just drops the assessment. The budget line is still dispersed amongst all the individuals.
- What I'm trying to do. I'm sorry, this is a professor meeting. I teach this, so I want to make sure.
- I appreciate that. Sorry, Randy. It's good. What my communication I'm trying to admit is everybody needs
- to be building the boat. Right, because it affects everybody. It affects all of us and how our reputation,
- how our view of our community statewide, internationally.
- I appreciate all you guys work and the discussions in the economic development is always important.
- As a professor of law, it's always important. The other gentleman, did you have anyone in? No,
- not this one. Okay. Well, anything else for the good of the calls? If not, we are adjourned.