Given our time constraints if it's okay, and we have quorum I know one one member is on their way but
we're just gonna call this meeting to order we have a this is a special session of the Bloomington City
Council on Wednesday 25th and the time is 5 p.m. Will the who's serving as the wonderful clerk? Okay.
I'm clerk Bolton. Will you please call the roll? councilmember clarity
Here Stasberg here Piedmont Smith here Zulek present. I'm sorry here daily. Yes Okay here and Rosenberger
here, thank you I hope I hope you did. Did you all have time? I know we had very limited Turnaround
here, but have you all had time to review the draft charge that was that was put
Online. If you haven't, okay, that's fine. So I'm gonna just ask that we do one small adjustment if
it's okay with the body to amend the agenda to first go over the charge and then we can make appointments
to the committee. So changing point A and point B. Is there anybody opposed to doing that? Okay, excellent.
Just going over the charge.
We're here for the general public's perspective so that you are.
read in, we are authorizing a hiring committee to lead and coordinate the council's processes for recruiting
and recommending candidates to fill, they can counsel legal and administrative roles and to ensure continuity
of council operations during the transition and advise council on the appropriate long-term structures
of these positions. And so I wrote up a charge in hopes of
really outlining what it is that we want this committee to do, how we want them to report back to us
as a body, and what limits they should have. I think most of these are fairly straightforward. But would
it be helpful if I read it just to bring everybody up to speed, or would anybody want?
A summary, okay, so in terms of the summary, the way that I've just drafted this up, but this is up
for discussion here, is that the scope of the work is obviously to evaluate whether, is to get this
position posted and eventually to present candidates to the council to vote on and to do all of the
administrative work that's required between
between sort of this moment and that outcome. One of the things that I've added that's maybe outside of
of our sort of standard operating procedures is that the first deliverable of this committee is to consider
the structure of our council office to make recommendations to the broader body on whether or not we
should continue with the current structure that we have, which is two attorneys and one legal researcher,
and whether we should, for example, explore separating the role of attorney and
council administrator, but then most importantly, figuring out how we might do that. And so I'm recommending
to the body some options of ways that we might go about doing that so that we all can vote and approve on that.
And then moving from there, allowing, then starting the process of allowing us all to give comments
on the job descriptions, then working with HR to get those posted. The second thing that's sort of outside
maybe of how we were forced to run this process in the past, and I emphasize that we were forced to
do it this way because the last time that we had a committee,
during council recess and it was quite difficult, I think, to put everybody together. And our council
president at the time did a valiant effort then. But the other side of this is sort of creating
a council-wide engagement structure to make sure that everybody has multiple opportunities to engage
at each stage here.
including, for example, opportunities to meet candidates before we present them to a vote. Other than
that, I think everything's fairly straightforward. Some ideas about record-keeping and documentation.
Did we have any thoughts or things that we wanted to add? Councilmember Piemont-Smith. Yes, thank you.
drafting this to get us started. One thing that you didn't mention in your summary was I believe the
intention to have the committee be the entity that our current employees that will still be in the council
office would report to the committee which I find problematic for employees to report to a committee
especially because the committee meetings will be public meetings.
Agreed agreed with that. What's your suggestion on what we could do instead. Well I suppose I mean I
don't think there's a really good way of doing it. One idea may not be the best idea is that the committee
would appoint somebody maybe the chair of the committee maybe somebody else to be the supervisor of
those employees.
I say that with the caveat that I think it'd be difficult for any nine of us to be the supervisor of
employees that we didn't hire or previously supervised, but I don't know what else we would do. Yeah,
that's under that's under five. It's a it's a point under five if you're looking for that point. Yeah,
it's five. They should have been lettered, but five B, I guess. That's a great point. I would have no issue
With actually amending that to be a either a single person just as at least as a liaison like a clear
liaison line to the rest of council Unless anybody has another idea for that Okay. Okay. Any other any
other thoughts on on the charge anything else that you'd like to change it, please? Currently the way
council office is Set up as there is one employee
Actually reports to counsel as a body and the others all report to that person and the way that it is
phrased in here multiple times is it's authorizing this Committee to Authorizing this committee to hire
all of those positions to write the descriptions for all of those positions And I don't think that any
one of us or as a body
Actually have the skills necessary to write all of those descriptions in terms of actually knowing what
all of our staff do and then I think that the structure is problematic already in that we have one person
who is supervised by nine part-time people and to have any kind of additional Like piling on to that
is really problematic. So I don't think that this committee should be authorized to hire any more than
the one person who we want to supervise, all of the other people within the office. So I can appreciate
the idea of going, okay, if we want to separate out the attorney with the administrator work, but we
still probably need to be one of those people need to be the supervising person of the rest of them.
And then that supervising person needs to be the one that council members and as a body do that. So
I think otherwise where,
We're taking a problem that at least I think no exists and making it worse. So I think and so tell me
if you and I'm glad that we're having this conversation if this to me I feel like that's addressed under
under the bullet points under.
point one, which is that the task of the committee is to make recommendations for, and ideally present
some options for what a new structure would look like, and then we can wait for further direction.
I mean, so I could imagine, as this one example, where we were to say, yes, we want to change, we have
three lines, we want to change line one to full attorney, line two to an administrator, this is one
example, I'm not saying this is what we should do, and then we bring that to the council and the council
says, yes,
We as a body agree that this is this is the way forward and we can determine at that point whether we
want to post those those positions I don't think that that takes care of it by the letter of this because
it authorizes this committee to it just has plurals and multiple times to You know process for recruiting
and recommending candidates to fill vacant roles To
Under for a bring forward no fewer than two qualified candidates for each open role to the full council
so that's I mean, I I absolutely agree in terms of like the changing of the structure and to authorize
that but that but that even within that change of the structure like I don't think that that we Know
enough about what our staff actually do to be able to write all of those job descriptions well without
I mean like I think that that we need to be able to write the one well that we're actually supervising
Right, but the rest of them we need that person that we're supervising to help us fill in those gaps
Super helpful. I'm councillor Flaherty You thank you. I think I'm understanding the the main substantive
issue being discussed here is whether we would hire for two positions at once or more and
or only one and then kind of let that person sequence the hiring. And I can imagine pros and cons for
either approach. Also, I guess my read of this that under item three, the sub-bullet for the first bullet
says to draft and finalize job descriptions subject to council approval. So I think if the full council
did not support moving forward with the proposed structure,
including hiring, for which you need a job description. I mean, maybe it could be clarified, but I think
as I read this document right now, we would not move forward with the position to hire two folks at
the same time unless the full council supported it. That's exactly how I intended it, yes. Okay.
So again, maybe an additional bullet could clarify that or something, but I think that is my read of
the document as well, and I appreciate the substantive issue, and I think it's an important one to consider.
Yeah, I agree.
Thank you so much. Other thoughts on these questions here, or any other things within the draft charge?
I have a thought. Council Member Rosenberger, go ahead. I think that is good so far, all those questions
and answers. And I think, too, that this process can take so long. I kind of like the idea that potentially
both could maybe be higher at the same time, but maybe not, or one, and then
one could come in and help with the other. I don't know, I think there are options that could be good
depending on what kind of candidates apply for what positions are created or changed or not changed.
My thought though was kind of a little bigger that this is, I think this is super hard and I think it
requires honestly like a level of expertise that I don't know that any one of us
necessarily brings or has time to figure out. And I am wondering if we should hire a consulting firm
to lead in this process. I mean, we hired a consulting firm to look at council salaries, which to me
was less complicated than this. Obviously nothing came of that. But I think this is an incredibly daunting
task. And when I think about being a part of it,
it does feel really hard and they're like, I don't know. And like, I would need to do a lot of reading
and like learning to feel like I can bring anything great to the table. I mean, I can do job descriptions.
But I'm just saying, I think there are people with expertise out there and like, should we consider
employing them? I think that's a really good point. Then I think we could,
add this to subpoint one as the immediate charges to also bring what options, what that would look like
and what that would mean, what implications that would have on timeline. I mean, I think that's a great
point. I think that should be something that's on the table at some point, especially if it's something
that we can do in an agile and quick way. My concern would be- Yeah, because I think for me, if I'm
working on it, I would potentially work faster
with like an expert in the field for like creating the right structure for like the work that we do,
which is chaotic and complicated. Okay, thanks. Yeah, totally, totally. Thank you, thank you for that
point. Okay, other thoughts or reactions to any of that? Any other considerations on this draft charge?
Please, Councilman Sasseberg. I have another question about
Councilmember Piedmont Smith was asking about earlier in terms of the day-to-day supervising supervision
and so your response to that was that the committee would assign somebody to do that or what was your
re can you clarify what your What your thoughts are related to somebody today? Like as a body like an
appointment. I think we should take somebody separate from the committee to and
If possible if we can come to some agreement about that, I think okay I think that that that would be
a good way forward if we're gonna do If we're gonna pursue it that way I think that like under the authority
it has that the authority of engaging temporary or external legal support essentially lies solely with
the committee and I think if there's gonna be a Separate individual being that staff liaison. I think
that something needs to change about
That authority to engage that temporary Support and I'm not sure like because I think that it makes
sense to be able to delegate that because of our
Being hard for all council look at all together But I also think that you have a single to have a single
person who and you're right because that single person Yeah, like if there's a single person dealing
with staff and then the committee which is separate doing that engagement Sure, then that could be a
challenge So I don't know if the single person could could do that engagement But then all of us as
a body could approve. Yeah. Yep. I think I think that's a brilliant point Councilmember Zulek and then
and then have a reflection on that too
We could just ensure continuity by putting the person who is going to be in charge of our employees
on the committee Like it's not is that not would that preclude us from? Interacting with legal. I think
I think I think it's I mean, I'd love counselor Stasberg some thoughts on this So you're saying that
that you would think that somebody on the committee would also be that person who was a
I think that that might be a lot of work.
I mean, I think that the hiring piece and simply dealing with those job descriptions and the stuff with
HR, like all of those steps to all of that process is gonna be a great deal of work in managing day-to-day
operations in terms of meetings and committee meetings and all of those pieces and making sure that,
I mean, what collectively, right now we'll have staff working all of them together more than 40 hours
a week, not all at the same time. And so I think that that might
be a lot for somebody who's on the committee to do all the committee responsibilities and do that. Yes,
thank you. Mindful of time. Curious, I'm Clerk Bolden. If you have any thoughts on this particularly,
I would welcome them at any time, obviously, throughout the conversation. But do you have any thoughts
on this question in particular? To clarify the question about managing the work and going through the
process of the hiring committee? No.
Of course, anything your thoughts are always welcome on all thoughts. But the question particularly
about our continuing interns, people who are currently in the office. So at the end of the period of
our staff attorneys, do you have any thoughts on how to support them? Yes.
One, I think you're conflating a bunch of issues and a step-by-step process. I think it would be helpful
to start with your committee appointment, have a rough charge going through and everything else. You're
going to have to take some steps back in terms of the workload and your expectations for the next few
months. You've done it before, you can do it again. In terms of supervising your staff, your interns
and your researcher, I think
You have options at this point. I'd be happy to help. We did that the last time you had a vacancy we
helped in terms of supporting council staff. We'd be happy to do so again which I informed council members
sorry about the other day and we will also be helping and have already had discussions in the office
about what we can do to make sure that you're actually getting the work of the city done. We don't want to see.
We don't want to see the work of the council stop in any way. We're all here to support the city. So
we're going to do what we can to make sure that you keep going. Yes. I hope that is helpful to your
concerns. Very helpful. If there's something more specific we can talk about it. We've only got 10 minutes
left in the room. And I think and I think I think to that point I think it also solidifies the idea
that having having sort of a single point person as the liaison
between council and the current fellows, that that person can also be the liaison in addition to president.
I can be helping with that with clerk's office. Please, Council Member Piedmont-Smith, and then we should
round up this part. Yes, just quickly to clarify, we have two fellows and we have one part-time temporary
researcher who works about 25 hours. Thank you. Thank you so much. OK, final comments, thoughts on this
draft charge.
So pending pending the the amendment of removing the job of overseeing and supervising the work of council
interns The the element of liaising with external entities that might be our pinch hitters if you will
Pending those two changes. Are there any it can I have a motion to approve this charge? Please that
councilmember Stasberg
I don't know if you guys are going to like this motion. So here's a proposal for the motion kind of
for now and then maybe think and maybe the meeting next week about something more thorough is to I move
to authorize the to be delegated ad hoc hiring committee to fulfill the
Scopes of work as listed in the draft agreement under number one number two number three Number four
Number six and number seven And seven includes authority and limitations, yes, no that oh I wasn't including
authority and limitations because The authority at least might be
And so that's where it's like instant because because I don't think that in the next seven days Will
in the next seven days that make a difference in terms of rewriting some of the documentation around
the authority no, but I do think I
I do think that we want to start. I mean, I think we've started this informally, but I do think that
it would be good to be able to engage with potential people who may be able to fill in in the short
term. And I think we don't want to delay on doing that. So that's really all this is saying. At the
end of the day, it would come to the body, I think, for authorization. Nobody could do that by themselves.
But we do want to be able, if we find a person, to make a quick decision on that.
In terms of the temporary yes, like you imagine imagine we want we want somebody outside of city legal
for yeah, right Sorry, thank you. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. Well, I don't know if she's finished the motion
I think I had finished the work and number one. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Good point So is there is
there a second and I see the clerk for the motion as is Okay
Was there a second because I know I just want to understand the vote. So is the motion to just basically
delete number five from the Purview of the committee is that the motion I think to revisit it Yeah,
it wasn't deleted so much as revisit the ones that I didn't specify so that then the work of the committee
could start immediately in terms of the pieces that are more in
eternal of looking at the job descriptions and starting that initial assessment and then it it could
hopefully get get rewritten with some of those other pieces that need some Amendment for the meeting
next week. So then there would be a mark final one done next week But I I mean I I agree that that part
of the work of the committee could be
Could be I think to your concern looking for that third party consultant And so then I was kind of looking
through going where like so maybe maybe it's authorizing the committee to complete Items 1 2 3 4 Yeah
6 and 7 and be further authorized to research and bring to the full council
a Recommendation for temporary or external legal support during this time second. Okay, there's a motion
and a second What we will write that down it's this that there's a motion in a second Can we suspend
our rules to not have a vote? Individually we can't okay. So in which case can can the clerk please
call the roll on on that because we have folks online
Okay, so councilmember Flaherty wait, hold on is there a problem to have substantive discussion? We
only have seven minutes, but going okay Yes We'll revisit it next week just just so we can get started
yes Yes, yes. Sorry. Yes, Bailey. Yes rough. Yes, I
Rosenberger. Yes. Okay. Um, fantastic. So, um, I, I now, sorry. Um, I'm, uh, so that, that was, uh,
that passes unanimously. Um, um, I'm now going to appoint, um, four people to the committee and I'd
like also to appoint, um, our, uh, the, the person that will be the liaison. Um, I, I, I,
I would like to appoint councilmember Piedmont Smith councilmember Zulik myself and councilmember Rallo
to be on the hiring committee and I would like to appoint Councilmember daily to be our liaison with
current staff I Thought that we were going to as a body appoint the liaison in the same way that we
appoint to
other Boards and commissions and things like that via the four people you mean or how Know that that
we vote on things like at the organizational meeting where somebody is Nominated or self nominated and
then as a body we vote on that. That was what I thought Yeah, I'm asking for a vote on on on all of
the above actually But but we can if you want to wait till next week where you get to appoint the committee
as president
Yeah, but I'm open. I'm open for you all to approve it. So it's just is everybody okay with those with
that with that for as the as the committee Council member Puma Smith. Are you happy to serve on the
committee? Yes, I will serve on the committee. I don't know if I'm happy but Well, no, if you're not
happy to I mean we can I mean There we can substitute out so no I I
I am willing to serve on the committee.
Council Member Ala, I hope in silence. One thing that, just for the good of the order, I intend to rotate
the committee a little bit as we get to different stages here. So for example, when we're actually doing
interviews, I would like Council Member Flaherty or Rosenbarger to be in those interviews. So just for
awareness here and similarly, if it gets too much work or something, we can rotate out. We'll bring
next week then to the meeting. Oh, Council Member Rosenbarger, we have two minutes, go ahead.
I'm sorry, I don't know how to address this and I wish I honestly had time to talk to you before the
meeting and I don't know if I can even do anything about it right now. I guess we, I feel like we have
a problem with confidentiality among our council members and the committee, I mean, this is gonna be
like things that definitely should not get out
And to the public sometimes, right, when we're talking about like people's resumes and all that stuff,
I guess I'm just worried about leaks. All right. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that is a clear,
I mean, that's a clear, I mean, FERPA thing. I mean, so we need to, I think we'll take as the first
issue some training for the committee to make sure that everybody is fully up to date on
on data protection and the rights of people applying to things. Thank you. Thanks. Critical, yep. Okay,
so we will bring the question of liaison then in the packet for next week's meeting. Are we all, would
you like to vote on the committee? Let's do a quick vote, or rather, I have motioned to do it, is there a second?
Okay, there's a motion and a second clerk. Will you please call the roll and then we can adjourn Stasper.
Yes. I'm sorry. I didn't hear you. Yes Piedmont Smith. No Zulek. Yes. I'm sorry. Yes daily. Yes Ruff.
Yes Rosenberger No That
Yes, that carries six to
I believe. Yes. All right. Thank you all so much. This meeting is adjourned. We'll continue. And I'll
reach out. I'm chairing the committee for now. I'll reach out with some next steps and the edits to
this for our next meeting. Thank you all for meeting at such short notice. We'll also try to schedule
an executive session for next week. Can I just see while we're here? And we have literally one minute.
Actually, we still have two.
Are there any council members who are not able to attend an executive session? That is tentative for
six o'clock right before our meeting next Wednesday That work for you all It works for me, but I question
of half our meeting would be enough you think 530 would be better I
Yes, okay. Okay. So thank you. Thank you council members and barter So I'll just just confirm with all
the parties make sure that we can notice it correctly I'll work with the clerk and council staff on
that And we'll confirm hopefully tomorrow that that meeting has been scheduled Thank you all again so
much for all of the service that you do this city. It's a pleasure working with you all we're done