- So just calling this meeting to order. This is a interview for interview committee a we are interviewing
- for the board of directors for BF or Bloomington Transit. I am Isak Sarri. I am a council member at
- large joined by Stasburg District 3 and also joined online by 8 Rosenberger District 2.
- Fantastic. And there are some members of the public here as well. We won't be doing public comment,
- but if you feel free to type in notes, and we will keep those on the record. OK. So we have a handful
- of questions. I'm Hank, and there's sort of like a standard set of questions, if you will. And we might
- have some clarifying and follow-up questions thereafter. But would love to just hear from you first,
- why you want to be a part of this board? What attracts you to the work that it does? Great question.
- I've had this desire to work in the public sector and better my community for years now. After I graduated
- from IU, I got accepted into the Peace Corps and was planning on going out to the country of Georgia
- for three years and doing work out there.
- Unfortunately, COVID happened a month before I was supposed to go. So I never got that opportunity,
- which is a big bummer. But throughout that process, I realized this is what I want to do. And so after
- biding my time for a little while, I came back to Bloomington. I was the Little 500 race director. So
- I advised about 700 different IU undergraduates. And that is, one, leading this race, but two, teaching
- these people
- professional skills, how to make it in the real world and also making their IU experience as great as
- possible. And that is, you know, getting around campus that's showing them resources that the city has
- to offer. And so it's all about giving back to the community that I live in. And then eventually, as
- you all know, I came to the city of Bloomington in planning and transportation as the bicycle and pedestrian
- coordinator. So working on smaller scale bike ped projects and eventually
- made my way into the Safe Streets Program Manager position, and now I am a public face for listening
- to the community in terms of what they want in their streets, what's working, what's not working, and
- also selling them ideas about how we can work together to make our community a safer, more convenient,
- more efficient place to travel from point A to point B. And so that leads me to right now where
- One, I have the professional expertise to work with Bloomington Transit and make it a better organization.
- Two, the local expertise because I've been in Bloomington off and on for about nine or 10 years now
- and I've been serving different corners of the community. But then three, I have the time and the willingness
- to put effort into this position. And so it's rare that you have
- all of those dots connecting in the ability and expertise to do it, but I'm in this position right now,
- I want to continue giving back to my community in a way that I know how and that way is through
- transportation and public transit. Thank you so much. As a follow-up with that, what experience do you
- have right now with this board at all in terms of what's been going on and their meetings and their
- responsibilities and that kind of thing?
- I really started thinking about applying for this position late last year. And since then, I've been
- listening and watching all of their board meetings to understand how exactly it works. Again, through
- my day job, I work with the transportation commission, sometimes the planning commission, the bike safety
- commission when that still existed. So I'm very aware of how boards and commissions in general work
- and function in the city, but
- Every board is a little bit different. They each have their own quirks. And so I've been watching in,
- reading the agendas of these board meetings. And then obviously in the past month or two, there have
- been some bigger changes and that has only pushed me farther into that desire to be on this board to
- make positive change for this community. Excellent. Do you guys remember Rosenbacher?
- Yeah, I'm just. OK, do you about the board too? Do you think the board is missing representation?
- And if so, what do you bring skills and experience to fill in those gaps? Like what would that what
- would that look like? Yeah, great question. That was actually something that I wanted to talk about
- in this interview is representation as a whole. I talked about my professional expertise in Bloomington
- representing
- a lot of IU students and now with the city representing the community as a whole. Again, these people
- that I try to represent through my day job are the people that need safe, efficient transportation the
- most. And I talk to thousands of people each year throughout the city. A lot of those people, I can
- use their comments in the projects I work on with the city. Most of those I can't though. A lot of the
- comments I get
- are about the accessibility of the transit stops, the route frequency to get to the west side of the
- city. For example, there was a recent project I was working on on Roger Street, and it goes right along
- the four west line. And that goes out to the Walmart Sam's Club area of town. And there are these people
- who need to get out there, but because the route only functions every hour,
- It's hard, it's very, very hard. And so that's just one example of, I'm not saying that I represent
- all of the community, but my job is to serve the community. And by doing that, I feel like I have a,
- at least a better, a better knowledge base of what the community as a whole needs. I think we all run
- into at some point, this status quo bias that things
- are find the way they are. And you start to become a bit complacent. But through my professional experience,
- I've learned you cannot become complacent because there are always people who need to travel from point
- A to point B and either can't or it is not convenient to do so. And so I want to, at least on this board,
- represent those people, whoever they might be and represent them in terms of
- pushing BT to create a transportation system that helps those people who need it the most. I have a
- follow-up to that question. Can you talk a bit about your experiences with public transit, first here,
- obviously, and then in other places? What has that told you or taught you about what makes a successful
- public transit system? Yeah, sure.
- I'll start with here first. I lived carless in Bloomington for about three years, and that forced me
- to use Bloomington Transit and bike around the city. When I was carless, part of the time was I was
- over in the Timber Ridge neighborhood on South Henderson Street, and there was a route that got me from
- South of town to downtown pretty easily.
- But my job being on North V lane, there was not a route that went up there. And so there were oftentimes
- when it was rainy or muggy that I would bike part of the way, transit part of the way, and it just wasn't
- convenient. And I think this is a common theme of Bloomington that when you need to transfer, it makes
- it incredibly hard to use public transit, especially when you have a timetable when you need to be somewhere. And so.
- I did try to use it. I didn't use it that often though, because it was just much more convenient to
- bike up there and then get sweaty, change clothes, go to work from there. I also lived in the Bryant
- Park neighborhood for a while when I didn't have a car and there are zero fixed routes through that
- neighborhood. That was tough. It was about a half mile walk, maybe four tens of a mile walk to get to
- the nearest bus station. And again,
- It just, it wasn't convenient for me to use it. I did use it at some points, but it was not a routine
- for me because it was not in my area. And even now living on a Roger street, I just talked about the
- four West line. There have been times that I have wanted to use that line to get out to the West side,
- to go to Lowe's or Menards or something like that. But when I think about, well, even if I plan my time,
- my schedule exactly right, and I can get the bus going out there, am I going to be able to get back
- without having to wait in the sun for about 30 to 45 minutes? I don't know. And so there have been good,
- I have had good experiences on Bloomington Transit. I want to tell you that, but the theme is that no
- matter where I am in the city, unless I'm going along a certain route, it is very hard to use. Now,
- contrary to that,
- I have lived in cities with magnificent public transit. I lived in Berlin, Germany for a summer. I lived
- in Montpellier, France for a couple summers. And then I was actually just, I just came back from Madison,
- Wisconsin and didn't have a car up there. And so all of those cities have more extensive, more interconnected
- routes. And it is simply convenient. It is the most convenient way to travel from point to point.
- And that's the end goal of Bloomington Transit. We want to make it as convenient, if not more convenient,
- than driving your own vehicle. We have different city documents, whether it's the Climate Action Plan,
- or the Comprehensive Plan, or the Transportation Plan, that prioritize public transit in some way. And
- to do that, we have to make it convenient for people to use. Yep. Yep. Excellent. Thank you so much.
- I think I'm going to go back to an earlier question that we asked yesterday that was kind of left out
- so far. And the question is, have you been part of a commission counselor board that focused on the
- betterment and wellness of a specific community, particularly a minority group? And if so, what was
- your role and what impact did it have? Good question. I don't know if this is directly answering your
- question, but
- Again, being the liaison for the Bike Ped Safety Commission for a few years and now bringing reports
- to the Transportation Commission, we are focusing on the people who are not able to or can't drive a
- motor vehicle, who have to get around Bloomington via walking, biking, public transit, and a lot of
- the groups that you just mentioned fall into that category, where we are looking at
- lower income folks, we're looking at minorities, we're looking at the most vulnerable people in Bloomington
- and how to make their lives not just convenient, but safe and easy, raise that quality of life to be
- in our city. Great, thank you. Okay, sorry, I'm just finishing a note. Okay, you've talked a little
- bit about this,
- What ideas do you have or could you see for public-private partnerships and solutions? And we kind of
- have another question related to this, that this is the last year that we have ED-lit funding, 3.7 million
- that goes to transit. And so along that line, too, what happens next? And what role do you see as the
- director of the board? Yeah, great questions.
- In terms of public-private partnerships, we are seeing so much development around the city, right? And
- as we see more development, there needs to be the transportation amenities along with that. That could
- just, and a lot of that is already in our UDO, but some of it's not. Whether that's bus shelters or
- accessible bus pads or bike parking by bus shelters, these things that
- Maybe if you don't ride transit, you don't think about as much, but if you do ride transit, these are
- necessary items to implement. Overall, and this could be public-private partnerships or simply a public
- project, we need better route frequency. That is my number one. Whether it is implementing something
- like the green line on 3rd Street to get from east to west or a north-south route, we need some.
- route that gets major destinations to major destinations with a 15 minute frequency. That should be
- the goal everywhere. And right now, because that isn't everywhere, that's why we see the full buses
- and people simply not riding the bus because it doesn't fit with their schedule. Again, it's all about
- convenience. And we can talk about fare free and micro transit and these other transit centric
- options at some point, I don't think we're there yet. We should be focusing on making it convenient
- first and then talking about the other extras after that. Can I ask a follow-up on the question
- on microtransit? Do you think that microtransit is working well at the moment in the city? No. At library,
- yeah? Yeah, of course. So every
- transportation authority, every transit authority has to have some sort of paratransit, and that's BT
- access, right? We're not getting rid of that. There are people that need BT access, and that is a must
- for our community. Scaling up microtransit, when you look at, and I don't have the numbers on me, but
- when you look at other communities that have done that, they are not seeing the same return on investment
- as if they would scale up or increase route frequency on their fixed routes. The fixed routes are there,
- because that is where we know people are going. Microtransit can fill in those gaps, but you as a transit
- authority are paying much more per customer than what you would be paying per customer on a fixed route.
- The amount of people who have ridden BT via microtransit is far and few between. Again,
- I wrote it once last summer when they had the downtown shuttle. That was because I sprained my ankle
- and I couldn't walk to work for a few days. There are situations in which, sure, that's great, but I'm
- not making this a routine thing. The fixed routes are where we see the demand. That is what we should
- be focusing our priorities on. Excellent. Excellent. Kind of as a follow-up to that a little bit, the
- question is,
- What is the one thing that's the largest problem with transit in Bloomington and how would you work
- to change that as a board member? What I just heard you say was a couple of things. One was better route
- frequency, and then you have these comments about microtransit. In the last few years, maybe a year
- or two especially, it seems there's been a really big uptake locally in microtransit. How would you
- as a board member impact some of that stuff that you just talked about in terms of
- see a microtransit? Great question. And I'm not saying that I'm going to come in guns blazing on the
- first board meeting and implement. Maybe the second. I understand it's about building relationships.
- That's so much of what you all do as elected officials. That's what I do as a city staff member. It's
- about building trust. And I know I have this expertise, but the board members don't know I have that.
- I need to first have those conversations and I understand there are different rules about what conversations
- you can have outside of public board meetings, but having those one-on-one conversations with board
- members to just talk about my experience, what I'm seeing from my perspective in Bloomington because
- everybody has a limited perspective. We all have these blinders on. My day job is to take off those
- blinders and see other people's perspectives and so hopefully,
- that can promote some good natured conversation and then eventually change. But I would like to push
- BT at least somewhat away from scaling up microtransit and how I do that, again, I need people to work
- with me. I don't know who that is, but it is about all in all, it's about building relationships and
- then providing the evidence behind it. Again, I talked about
- There are cities that have done this. Let's show them what cities have tried to do this, what's worked,
- what's not worked, because I don't want to reinvent the wheel here. Transit is not new. I don't need
- Bloomington to be innovative. I want us to look at the other cities that have either done something
- right or done something wrong, and we can learn from that and go forward.
- When you think about, and so sort of pulling the thread on a couple of comments, there are a lot of
- different needs. So I wholeheartedly hear the argument that you focus first on where there's most demand,
- right? But then you also noted that there are certain things that we have to do because there are diverse
- needs. And so I'd love to elaborate a bit more on that.
- How do we deal with this tension between where we get the most bang for our buck, if you will, versus
- having a public service that meets the variety of public needs that exist? Yeah. I don't know if there
- is a clear answer to that question. I'll be honest. It is a tough, tough balance in where to prioritize
- your limited
- funds and resources in a transportation authority, right? I don't know if I have much more than that
- because it all comes down to listening to the community. That is what we as staff members, as officials
- should be doing is listening to our community, but also using data to drive our decisions. Where is
- the most bang for our buck? But also knowing that there is nuance
- in what we do, that there should be these availability of different needs, but maybe we don't need to
- scale it as big as we think we need to scale it. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Excellent. Thank you. I'm sorry. I'm
- in a coffee shop, and they're grinding a bunch of things. Do you guys hear that? We can't hear it. We
- can't hear it at all. Oh, good. OK. Because I'm like, this is going to go on a while. This just made
- me want to circle back to the partnership
- And I think as race director and like spending a lot of time at IU, like what do you think the future
- looks like for like IU and BT? Right, anything kind of like your ideal situation or where you think
- it like actually pragmatically might go if anywhere? One long-term goal I have for Bloomington Transit
- is to merge with IU campus bus.
- We have seen other college towns do that. Chapel Hill and a UNC bus did it. I think Kalamazoo and Central
- Michigan did it recently. There's another one I'm thinking about too, but there has been this trend
- of campus bus systems and city bus systems merging into one. One, because it's more efficient overall.
- You have one umbrella, one organization making the transit system work. But two, and maybe more importantly,
- You get more federal dollars. Transit authorities receive federal money based on ridership. And right
- now, Bloomington Transit's ridership is X amount of riders, right? IU Campus Bus's ridership is X amount
- of riders. Because Bloomington Transit cannot use those IU Campus Bus ridership in their total ridership,
- they are not getting their, I'll put it in quotes, warranted federal funding for
- buses for property, for BRT, whatever they want to spend it on. And so you see these other cities that
- have combined their ridership upticks by X percent and they are able to get more federal funds. That's
- the goal here. And I absolutely understand. IU has been approached with this before and they have not
- been interested because they like control of their own bus system.
- And so I don't know how that works in terms of creating that partnership to merge bus systems into one.
- And maybe that's more on city council and the mayor and elected officials than board members, but there
- could be a genuine citywide push to do that, create some pressure in some way, because it would
- wholeheartedly benefit our community if these two bus systems combine into one.
- Why do you think IU wants control? Why does IU want to retain control over its buses? That's a good
- question. IU, and not just within transportation and transit, but they like to keep, whether it's property
- or whether it's street ownership,
- They like to have it, I think, for that, the lack of variability, maybe, that they can choose what to
- do long term, and they can make those choices. They don't have to answer to anyone else. Where they
- are the state, we are the city, and there is a bit of a, I think maybe, I don't know what to call it,
- but there is definitely two partnerships, or two entities talking to each other.
- but they don't necessarily have to answer to the city in some respects, and this is just one of them.
- Awesome. Go on down to the bottom. This was mentioned earlier is bundled with another question, but
- I'm going to bring it out more directly about the economic development-lit supplementation to BT, which
- has gone on for
- Five years, maybe four or five years, and this is technically the last year of it. And so what are your
- views on what happens next with regard to that kind of like funding challenge and upcoming changes?
- You know, they have a new management center coming on or right now or new management company. They're
- working on building that new center on profile Parkway.
- What is, just talk about those kinds of changes. You said you've been watching meetings. So I'm assuming
- that you're at least a little in the know about some of these changes that are upcoming. So in terms
- of the new property on Profile Parkway, I'm aware that they've been applying for federal grants for
- that property and the new bus stations out there. And that is, again,
- That's about what a 30 to $50 million project. And we're talking about what three and three and a half
- million dollars, I think is what you said. So that is not even really a dent into that. And so it could
- go to something there, but it could, we could also wait on that until BT receives a federal grant. Again,
- that's an if, but usually they do receive federal funds in some way or another. And these funds could
- go to improving
- fixed routes in some way or another. That could be implementing shelters and accessible bus pads on
- all fixed route stops. That could be buying new electric buses because it's in the strategic plan to
- go zero emissions. And I think BTs may be about, oh, I'm going to get this number wrong, maybe about
- 40% of the way there, 30% of the way there. They are making progress, but it's a slow progress. And
- so they could buy
- two to three buses with that money. Really, I'm not going to prescribe solutions when I don't know all
- of the options that staff have talked about because staff are the ones who are more knowledgeable about
- this than anyone else. So I'd like to talk to staff before I prescribe solutions, but anything to improve
- fixed routes would be preferable to me unless there are meaningful small purchases they can make with
- that new headquarters.
- Hey, did you have another question? Not right this second, actually. I'm good. Excellent. Is there anything
- that we haven't asked you that you feel like we should ask you? Nope. Or anything else you'd like to
- tell us? No, I think I'm good to go.
- Excellent. Excellent. Thank you so much for, it's funny because the screens over here and the things
- over here. So I am looking at you. Thank you so much for just all your service to the city and your
- interest, obviously in being on this commission and wonderful ideas and energy towards this. Just so
- very grateful for your time, Hank, and for everything you do. For sure. Hey, thank you all. I appreciate
- it. Thank you. Talk soon. Thank you. Bye. Okay.
- Great. So before we get thoughts, just a logistics question, are we going to do the fourth interview?
- I don't remember who the fourth interview is anymore. It's Perry Mall. Excuse me, Perry Mall. He's out
- of town this week and wanted to check availability for the week of next week, the week in the 17th.
- You also have another application that just came through last night. Oh. It's Sharon Baker. Let's see.
- So yeah, so what are thoughts about the more interviews? To be honest, I'm the one who said that we
- should just interview all of them. I'm not really regretting that right now, because now what I hear
- so far is that we have three good candidates. And I'm like, oh my god. Yeah.
- I don't think we need to at least add anyone new to the pool that wasn't there before we started this
- process. I think that's okay to say kind of, you know, we have four to consider. I think two, we can
- consider the fourth whether or not we interview. There's the pretty in-depth application. I'm okay doing whatever.
- And I remain, I think, in the same position, which is I feel very comfortable with all of these applicants.
- I have some thoughts that might distinguish them slightly, depending on what we want to achieve. But
- I would feel comfortable. And to your point, Kate, I also feel comfortable with the information given
- to consider our fourth candidate as well.
- Okay, well, so let's see what, what were, what were, what were your maybe first, we hear general thoughts
- that they were all great, but what were, what were your maybe more specific thoughts first, Kate? I
- think this is hard. I think they are all three pretty rock star candidates that bring three different
- things that I would love on the board to the board. I think Kent has the,
- Institutional knowledge, which is very useful. I think that has the ability to wrangle data and present
- it very quickly. And I think has community perspectives. I think they're all great. What do you think?
- Probably very similar in terms of all three of them being good at bringing slightly different things
- to the board.
- that could all be good things in terms of the candidate for next week. I'm just looking at applications
- and remembering, yeah, this was another person who's similar to Kent, has had a lot of experience in
- the field. I remember at the time going, would they be really similar? Because one of the things I'm
- thinking about is this vote next Tuesday and Kent's words of like, depending on where that goes, we
- may or may not be interested. I don't necessarily want to make a decision today because I do want to
- see where that goes.
- to see if one of our candidates takes themselves out of the pool. I also am interested in that question
- of a five-member board versus a seven-member board and what the two of you think about that in terms of
- Initial thoughts of that before I take that to the committee on council processes, because that could
- be another piece. I know that we don't necessarily and I respect that. I can't remember which one of
- you said it anymore. Not wanting to bring in another applicant from last night. But when I look at their
- application, they're a regular access user. And so that also is.
- potentially a relevant perspective and one that we talked about during one of the interviews yesterday
- in terms of, it was Kent, I believe, in terms of a user with disabilities and a user of our
- public transportation system. So just wanting to hear a little bit of what you guys think about that
- seven versus five in terms of moving forward into the future and then maybe setting a meeting next week,
- no matter what, maybe to interview Perry
- as another one, and maybe just to be able to discuss the three that we have. Yeah. So I'm thinking first
- on the question of seven versus five. I mean, I'll tell you that during the interview yesterday with
- Kent, had we given hot reflections, right after the interview, I would have been like, okay, we should
- increase this to seven, particularly because I was enjoying
- the triangulation of them on sort of known problems, but new approaches to those problems. And so, but
- of course, I think that the logistical difficulties associated with having a seven member board versus
- a five member board, I think are something that we already had identified, but I don't know if
- if this added value is enough to overcome the significant pain points that having seven people is likely
- to cause. That being said, I think that I enjoyed, so first I sort of would put Hank and I like you
- will say, I think across the three candidates so far, I think they all had a consistent view of the
- problems. I think that
- They just sort of were coming at it from different angles, which was really interesting to see. I don't
- think they disagreed on the direction that we need to go in with BT. I think, though, that Hank viewed
- it through the lens of the interface with the city, which I thought was interesting in other city programs.
- That is a huge advantage to me. Where you started thinking about, we're doing all these other things
- and how do we make sure that these things are being leveraged and aligned with what's going on with
- BT, I think was a really good perspective. Now, other people like the city liaison can be presenting
- that as well, but I just think that Hank is in a very good position to do that. Now, on the other hand
- with Hank,
- When asked the question about IU, I think that this is something that was telling about Kent and his
- experience.
- Kent understood having led IU transit for so long, and he said the exact same thing. He was like,
- we need to, you know, merging would be a good idea. We'd make more money, et cetera, et cetera. But
- then his perspective was, yes, but the things that we need to address are state issues, and we need
- to address the fact that IU doesn't feel like we're going to deal with their students well. And actually,
- that answer,
- When and that's why I asked the question of Hank I was like, why do you think that is right in my he
- didn't have the institutional awareness of what is the pain point if this is what we're trying to address
- and so like if that was actually a direction we were trying to go in which of them.
- Is better position to sort of help make progress in that position, maybe as can and then I think just
- that generally his approach. I think that he he broke down very clearly, you know, with like three clear
- points about like how he thinks about transit and how all decisions need to go through those lenses,
- which I think the others echoed, but I just think he had the clearest sense of like, this is how you
- make decisions about transit and this is what you prioritize. So, I mean, again, I think they're all
- good. I might give a little bit of an edge to Zach. I think that only because I would have given it
- to Kent, but I think that
- My only, you know, obviously, as much as I hope that we're able to figure out some way to pull back
- the contract signing, I don't know the likelihood or viability of that. And so, I mean, he's made fairly
- clear that if we go with the new company, that he's not going to be on board. So, I mean, so maybe a
- moot point, right? But assuming that that happened, that might have, you know, like 0.05 advantage to
- him over the other two.
- Um, thank you. That's really good. That's great to hear all that stuff. I think, um, to just like the
- point of five or seven, why does my screen? It's like zooming in on me. I'm not doing anything. Um,
- I, first I would wonder, I think for quorum issues, it's not that it doesn't change that much because
- it's just one more person who has to be there out of two. I think it's okay. Um,
- I do wonder if we're just not getting enough array of expertise with five. It just feels very hard that
- I think there are skill sets that are missing on the five. I'm going to come back to that. But I think,
- too, I would want to know, is it mayoral or is it council appointment? Because we don't know where the,
- would it be one of each?
- Yeah, one of each. I actually know that the state logic that it would be four mayoral appointments and
- three council appointments right now. It's three mayoral and two council. And then it would still be
- the one political party's orientation, one fewer. So we would need probably another Democrat. We need
- one Democrat, one Republican, or one independent. Right. It could be a very interesting makeup then.
- You could have a libertarian.
- You could only ever have three Democrats potentially, and then like a Green Party, a Libertarian, and
- it would be, it could potentially be very different, I guess. I do wonder about the skill sets, because,
- right, I think, and I think, Hopi, I'm on your page that maybe we wait until after they have their meeting
- on the third Tuesday, which is Tuesday.
- just to see where Kent is. I think it is great that he's just honest with us, and I understand what
- he's saying there. I think, too, I think about what I actually want on the board versus someone who
- can weigh in on the board. So I think Hank's community perspective is very good. I think, too, he is
- in an interesting position and a valuable
- valuable position to BT that he works for the city. So he could be going to the meeting sometimes, like
- they could have him as a guest, right? To like weigh in on things and wouldn't necessarily have to be
- part of the board for that. I think Zach's ability to seriously like gather historical data and like,
- I mean, the stuff he brought into us, you know, like,
- Oh, I was looking at ridership over the years and this happened and that happened and this route went
- away. And I was like pretty blown away I think by that. And that I think sometimes what I want to on
- city council is someone who can kind of more objectively present something to me than like potentially
- the administration or a council sponsor of an ordinance, right? And I think he would bring that. I mean, I just,
- So I think in terms of these three, I lean probably like they're also very close, but like that can
- tank. And I think too about having someone on the board who uses BT access. I again think about like,
- I do like to have other people's perspectives, but I also think like a governing board member needs
- to bring more for me than like just their transit experience. So,
- Um, right. Like I, because I think we can get transit experience through like surveys or interviews.
- Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I, one, one thought, and I asked this question, I probably, I didn't do a good
- enough job of bringing this question up on the other two sides, but I did ask this question of Zach
- and this was the one, um, I think minor,
- minor weakness, pain point, I don't know. And I think that Hank maybe alluded to this, but in a different
- way, which was like, yes, loving the position, loving the view, how do you use this position on BT to
- affect that type, like the theory of change, I guess, right? It's like what, you know,
- what does having you on this board mean for those outcomes and that clear connection? It may be something
- that we need to do a little bit more thinking about so that whoever we appoint, that we can also give
- them. And I think that actually this vote that Dr. Obermeyer sort of helped us identify illustrated
- the need to give institutional
- like strength, right, to the people on the board, because I think, you know, as it happens with council
- as well, like we're in this situation a lot where like, where there's a thing we're allowed to do, but
- we don't know how to do it, you know, and it's always late until you know what I'm saying. And so we
- might at our next meeting, regardless of who we appoint, like think about having another meeting with
- them so we can think through and maybe have like Larry, there are some things we can like talk through
- about, okay, these are the type of things that can be achieved with this board. These are the type of
- levers that you have. This is how you might approach these type of things.
- And for that matter, we should meet with both or all three of our council appointees and talk through
- some of those things a little bit. Is it three, two, that was three? Oh, okay, deal around, yeah.
- So yeah. But anyway, so just adding that for the... We have three. Yeah, we have three. It's three,
- two. I thought the mayor had three. No, it's us. We have three. I think we have Doug, Nancy and Kent.
- Dog is one of ours, right? Yeah, okay. So that's I mean, just for just for just a thought about,
- you know, like for aside from this exercise we're doing now, we should just chat with our board members
- and get to know them a little better outside of this process. Do you all what do you all think about
- just holding off until later next week?
- I would like to do that personally. Yeah. I'm okay waiting because I think we should do the fourth interview.
- We invited the person. I think it's, you know, we so. Yeah. As much as I'd be happy to appoint any of
- these and the fact though that, you know, it's not, we're not going to face a quorum issue. Kenza is
- going to be there for this Tuesday. Um, you know, so, so I think it's the only caveat is I'm not here
- next week. So, um, so I'll be back. Let me see. Yeah, I think I'm in town all week next week.
- Are you, can you zoom in, Isak or no? It's going to be very difficult to do that. Just zoom in in the
- middle of the night. Oh, you're far away. Okay. Um, I mean, we do. Here's the thing. Kent is on the
- board for 90 days. He is one of our top candidates in a way. It's not an extreme rush.
- I think we would want to, oh, that's what you were saying. I think we would just want to appoint someone
- by the next. We could actually appoint anybody until our September meeting anyway because we don't have
- another regular council session until September. What I was going to say though is...
- So it's not a limitation. I just, I just didn't like, because I am comfortable with all three of these
- candidates. I'm comfortable on paper with Paul as well. If, if, if you all at the next meeting feel
- so that we don't have to have a third meeting for all of us to deliberate about, like, I am very comfortable
- with any one of these appointments. So like, I like appointments, you know, so, so like, yeah, sure.
- Only if Hopi and I disagree then would you have to be in a meeting or also this is going to council. So we can
- present it all to council and do a vote there as well, I think. Yeah. And what we could do then for
- efficiency, I can watch the meeting, right? Yeah. And then just add a regular session during our regular
- session. So Hopi and I will be in person to interview the fourth candidate, and then we can either make
- a decision there or not. Yeah. And I think even if we don't disagree, I think that because the candidates
- are really similar,
- that your insight could be valuable anyway. I guess maybe I'm just feeling especially waffly today,
- but I think that it's because all three of them are so good. They're good, exactly. I mean, think too,
- they'll help you that this is just a recommendation. We can come to council with, we can present
- what we have gone through here and have counsel decide as well. Like we don't have to have
- a firm recommendation. Might I also say, so a thought is, oh, two thoughts. One is to check political
- affiliation of the people who've applied because there's a possibility in which one of these few was
- independent and or a Republican. I mean, unlike they'd be independent, but could be a Republican. If
- we had two people,
- All right, a Republican and a Democrat. Now the idea of expanding to seven makes sense. So I would be
- I would be in favor of expanding if we had a candidate ready to go. Right. So so a different political
- party. Exactly. Exactly. So so like if we if we had so, you know, if we had a Republican ready to go,
- then I would say we should do the work of expanding. And then we essentially then would be appointing
- two more people with a recommendation to the mayor. If we have, here's great people, here's one more
- person you could appoint, just as an example. But we would be in an amazing position just imagining
- that one of these people who has applied, including the person who just applied, would be
- You know, it could be a Republican, in which case you already have three candidates, right? You know?
- Or an independent, honestly, or a libertarian. But I mean, I think it's harder sometimes to show to
- be independent in Indiana because that locks you out of all primaries. But I mean, I know when I was
- door knocking, there were some people that said, yeah, I'm an independent, so I vote in primary. But
- to be an independent, you either don't vote in the primaries or you can change who you vote for in the
- primaries. Right. So you can all vote because primaries are
- But I'm saying, if somebody has voted, could a person have voted, let's say they voted Democrat, then
- Republican, Democrat, then Republican, does that make them an independent? Like the way that you look
- at primaries, it's two primaries. I think we've looked at this before, and I think it has to be two
- of the same consecutive ballots in your primary. Okay, but then how do you become an independent, Deanna?
- Well, that's a good question. So would it not be that if you, over a period of four years, voted Democrat,
- the Republican, Democrat, the Republican, or something like that? We'd have to check with legal on that
- one, because we've not ran into that issue. And does not voting at all mean one is an independent? That
- also seems like a cognitive leap now. Yeah, that's a good, I think it's basically
- It's just an olive boy also is. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. Is this board within the city limits requirements?
- Yeah, yes. Let's ask Larry or maybe about the, how are you an independent? Um, I, I know. I think, I
- don't know.
- I don't wanna talk about it right there, I think. I think there could be some candidates down the pipeline
- to look at. And I almost still wonder, I mean, this doesn't have to be decided now, of course, about
- the member board. I would wanna talk to the manager to see what they would think of it. And then, yeah,
- I almost just think we're missing
- There's missing skill tips that a normal governing board has. Not that the board members are inadequate,
- it's only because it's a five-person board. It's really hard to get everything in there, I think. So
- we could also just talk to council about it as well. Yeah, well, I'm going to bring it up in the CCP,
- the Committee on Council Processes, because that tends to be where all these type two changes start.
- is to see what they think about it. And I did mention it to Larry yesterday, just in terms of those
- pros and cons, but also generally, I think one of the things that we also discussed in this session
- was changing, like updating our Title II stuff around this word anyway, because some of the state guidelines
- are not in our local guidelines and it's easier to look at our local versus the state stuff. And so
- even if it just reflects what the state stuff says,
- it might be easier to have it in our local code, depending on what it is. And so I have that up on my
- computer. It's kind of on my to-do list to figure out what is our local code relying on, referring to
- state code? And could we make our local code a little bit clearer and affirm self-responsibility? Especially
- because we just asked the question, what levers can this work full? And that kind of stuff.
- Yeah, also that's a I just I have the opposite perspective that I prefer to just refer to state code
- because it can change. And so I like just a little C state code, you know, exactly. Yeah, I think I
- think the B square asked the question about posting videos. Yeah, I just responded. I'm not certain.
- And we've had this issue with cats before. It's like hodgepodge hit or miss as to why they
- attend some meetings and then don't attend others. I'll get with cats to figure out if today's meeting
- will also be uploaded and yesterday's, and hopefully we'll see it here on the website soon. They should
- be a theory. Yes. Yeah. Right. Well, is it okay with you all if I adjourn? I've got to get to an 11.30.
- Are we not deciding a different time for
- Yeah, let's. It will definitely be easier to do that. Well, especially next week, Kate, it's really
- you and I that need to make sure BISOC is 13 hours time difference. So what's good for you, Kate? And
- it needs to be after Tuesday because that's what that meeting is. Next week, I can do Wednesday.
- Okay. What time? All day. Okay. Honestly, that's, then I'm out, um, Thursday, Friday, or, it doesn't
- matter, but I'm out. Okay. And then I could do the 24th. I mean, then I could look at the next week,
- but that's just like my physical availability in town. Great. Um, Jennifer, what is the clerk schedule
- like on the Wednesday? Um,
- Let's see, because then we also like you need to contact. So it seems to be an interview to. I see.
- Three probably would be the better time if possible. There's quite a few things that are happening in
- the morning. And then there is a meeting with the PIO officers at one
- to 215 that day. I could do late afternoon like that as well. So Kate, that would be good for you too,
- like somewhere between like say three and five. Yeah. Anytime Wednesday is okay. Okay. Okay. So yeah,
- if you could maybe reach out to- I'll check. Why am I blanking out his name again? Perry. Perry.
- Perry Mall. Okay. To see if he's available on that Wednesday afternoon.
- Okay, we can do that in our view and then we can debrief and. Okay, that sounds good. Okay. Yeah, sorry.
- I forgot I have to leave. I'm not fine. Okay. Thing that I will say really quickly, because I know some
- of y'all have to go yesterday. Another application just came through from the commission on the status
- of black males to do the cloud.
- Resigned originally and so, um, Vivian is a new applicant. I've talked or sent an email to, um, Crystal
- Ritter, who is the state and civil city director to ask about this one. And she said her and Michael
- Sharmas met with her to talk about, um, like what she wants to get involved in. And they highly recommend her for.
- the commission on the status of black males. I just wanted to bring that to your attention. Perhaps
- we can add that as a discussion item for next week and that will give us time to review that application.
- I did see that that was advertised. Yes. Maybe there will be other applicants by next week too that
- we need to consider. Does that sound good to you, Kate? Yes. Does that sound good to you too? I'm very
- happy with Crystal. I'm happy to support their appointment.
- Are we ready to adjourn now? Everybody okay? Uh huh, thank you all.