So just calling this meeting to order. This is a interview for interview committee a we are interviewing
for the board of directors for BF or Bloomington Transit. I am Isak Sarri. I am a council member at
large joined by Stasburg District 3 and also joined online by 8 Rosenberger District 2.
Fantastic. And there are some members of the public here as well. We won't be doing public comment,
but if you feel free to type in notes, and we will keep those on the record. OK. So we have a handful
of questions. I'm Hank, and there's sort of like a standard set of questions, if you will. And we might
have some clarifying and follow-up questions thereafter. But would love to just hear from you first,
why you want to be a part of this board? What attracts you to the work that it does? Great question.
I've had this desire to work in the public sector and better my community for years now. After I graduated
from IU, I got accepted into the Peace Corps and was planning on going out to the country of Georgia
for three years and doing work out there.
Unfortunately, COVID happened a month before I was supposed to go. So I never got that opportunity,
which is a big bummer. But throughout that process, I realized this is what I want to do. And so after
biding my time for a little while, I came back to Bloomington. I was the Little 500 race director. So
I advised about 700 different IU undergraduates. And that is, one, leading this race, but two, teaching
these people
professional skills, how to make it in the real world and also making their IU experience as great as
possible. And that is, you know, getting around campus that's showing them resources that the city has
to offer. And so it's all about giving back to the community that I live in. And then eventually, as
you all know, I came to the city of Bloomington in planning and transportation as the bicycle and pedestrian
coordinator. So working on smaller scale bike ped projects and eventually
made my way into the Safe Streets Program Manager position, and now I am a public face for listening
to the community in terms of what they want in their streets, what's working, what's not working, and
also selling them ideas about how we can work together to make our community a safer, more convenient,
more efficient place to travel from point A to point B. And so that leads me to right now where
One, I have the professional expertise to work with Bloomington Transit and make it a better organization.
Two, the local expertise because I've been in Bloomington off and on for about nine or 10 years now
and I've been serving different corners of the community. But then three, I have the time and the willingness
to put effort into this position. And so it's rare that you have
all of those dots connecting in the ability and expertise to do it, but I'm in this position right now,
I want to continue giving back to my community in a way that I know how and that way is through
transportation and public transit. Thank you so much. As a follow-up with that, what experience do you
have right now with this board at all in terms of what's been going on and their meetings and their
responsibilities and that kind of thing?
I really started thinking about applying for this position late last year. And since then, I've been
listening and watching all of their board meetings to understand how exactly it works. Again, through
my day job, I work with the transportation commission, sometimes the planning commission, the bike safety
commission when that still existed. So I'm very aware of how boards and commissions in general work
and function in the city, but
Every board is a little bit different. They each have their own quirks. And so I've been watching in,
reading the agendas of these board meetings. And then obviously in the past month or two, there have
been some bigger changes and that has only pushed me farther into that desire to be on this board to
make positive change for this community. Excellent. Do you guys remember Rosenbacher?
Yeah, I'm just. OK, do you about the board too? Do you think the board is missing representation?
And if so, what do you bring skills and experience to fill in those gaps? Like what would that what
would that look like? Yeah, great question. That was actually something that I wanted to talk about
in this interview is representation as a whole. I talked about my professional expertise in Bloomington
representing
a lot of IU students and now with the city representing the community as a whole. Again, these people
that I try to represent through my day job are the people that need safe, efficient transportation the
most. And I talk to thousands of people each year throughout the city. A lot of those people, I can
use their comments in the projects I work on with the city. Most of those I can't though. A lot of the
comments I get
are about the accessibility of the transit stops, the route frequency to get to the west side of the
city. For example, there was a recent project I was working on on Roger Street, and it goes right along
the four west line. And that goes out to the Walmart Sam's Club area of town. And there are these people
who need to get out there, but because the route only functions every hour,
It's hard, it's very, very hard. And so that's just one example of, I'm not saying that I represent
all of the community, but my job is to serve the community. And by doing that, I feel like I have a,
at least a better, a better knowledge base of what the community as a whole needs. I think we all run
into at some point, this status quo bias that things
are find the way they are. And you start to become a bit complacent. But through my professional experience,
I've learned you cannot become complacent because there are always people who need to travel from point
A to point B and either can't or it is not convenient to do so. And so I want to, at least on this board,
represent those people, whoever they might be and represent them in terms of
pushing BT to create a transportation system that helps those people who need it the most. I have a
follow-up to that question. Can you talk a bit about your experiences with public transit, first here,
obviously, and then in other places? What has that told you or taught you about what makes a successful
public transit system? Yeah, sure.
I'll start with here first. I lived carless in Bloomington for about three years, and that forced me
to use Bloomington Transit and bike around the city. When I was carless, part of the time was I was
over in the Timber Ridge neighborhood on South Henderson Street, and there was a route that got me from
South of town to downtown pretty easily.
But my job being on North V lane, there was not a route that went up there. And so there were oftentimes
when it was rainy or muggy that I would bike part of the way, transit part of the way, and it just wasn't
convenient. And I think this is a common theme of Bloomington that when you need to transfer, it makes
it incredibly hard to use public transit, especially when you have a timetable when you need to be somewhere. And so.
I did try to use it. I didn't use it that often though, because it was just much more convenient to
bike up there and then get sweaty, change clothes, go to work from there. I also lived in the Bryant
Park neighborhood for a while when I didn't have a car and there are zero fixed routes through that
neighborhood. That was tough. It was about a half mile walk, maybe four tens of a mile walk to get to
the nearest bus station. And again,
It just, it wasn't convenient for me to use it. I did use it at some points, but it was not a routine
for me because it was not in my area. And even now living on a Roger street, I just talked about the
four West line. There have been times that I have wanted to use that line to get out to the West side,
to go to Lowe's or Menards or something like that. But when I think about, well, even if I plan my time,
my schedule exactly right, and I can get the bus going out there, am I going to be able to get back
without having to wait in the sun for about 30 to 45 minutes? I don't know. And so there have been good,
I have had good experiences on Bloomington Transit. I want to tell you that, but the theme is that no
matter where I am in the city, unless I'm going along a certain route, it is very hard to use. Now,
contrary to that,
I have lived in cities with magnificent public transit. I lived in Berlin, Germany for a summer. I lived
in Montpellier, France for a couple summers. And then I was actually just, I just came back from Madison,
Wisconsin and didn't have a car up there. And so all of those cities have more extensive, more interconnected
routes. And it is simply convenient. It is the most convenient way to travel from point to point.
And that's the end goal of Bloomington Transit. We want to make it as convenient, if not more convenient,
than driving your own vehicle. We have different city documents, whether it's the Climate Action Plan,
or the Comprehensive Plan, or the Transportation Plan, that prioritize public transit in some way. And
to do that, we have to make it convenient for people to use. Yep. Yep. Excellent. Thank you so much.
I think I'm going to go back to an earlier question that we asked yesterday that was kind of left out
so far. And the question is, have you been part of a commission counselor board that focused on the
betterment and wellness of a specific community, particularly a minority group? And if so, what was
your role and what impact did it have? Good question. I don't know if this is directly answering your
question, but
Again, being the liaison for the Bike Ped Safety Commission for a few years and now bringing reports
to the Transportation Commission, we are focusing on the people who are not able to or can't drive a
motor vehicle, who have to get around Bloomington via walking, biking, public transit, and a lot of
the groups that you just mentioned fall into that category, where we are looking at
lower income folks, we're looking at minorities, we're looking at the most vulnerable people in Bloomington
and how to make their lives not just convenient, but safe and easy, raise that quality of life to be
in our city. Great, thank you. Okay, sorry, I'm just finishing a note. Okay, you've talked a little
bit about this,
What ideas do you have or could you see for public-private partnerships and solutions? And we kind of
have another question related to this, that this is the last year that we have ED-lit funding, 3.7 million
that goes to transit. And so along that line, too, what happens next? And what role do you see as the
director of the board? Yeah, great questions.
In terms of public-private partnerships, we are seeing so much development around the city, right? And
as we see more development, there needs to be the transportation amenities along with that. That could
just, and a lot of that is already in our UDO, but some of it's not. Whether that's bus shelters or
accessible bus pads or bike parking by bus shelters, these things that
Maybe if you don't ride transit, you don't think about as much, but if you do ride transit, these are
necessary items to implement. Overall, and this could be public-private partnerships or simply a public
project, we need better route frequency. That is my number one. Whether it is implementing something
like the green line on 3rd Street to get from east to west or a north-south route, we need some.
route that gets major destinations to major destinations with a 15 minute frequency. That should be
the goal everywhere. And right now, because that isn't everywhere, that's why we see the full buses
and people simply not riding the bus because it doesn't fit with their schedule. Again, it's all about
convenience. And we can talk about fare free and micro transit and these other transit centric
options at some point, I don't think we're there yet. We should be focusing on making it convenient
first and then talking about the other extras after that. Can I ask a follow-up on the question
on microtransit? Do you think that microtransit is working well at the moment in the city? No. At library,
yeah? Yeah, of course. So every
transportation authority, every transit authority has to have some sort of paratransit, and that's BT
access, right? We're not getting rid of that. There are people that need BT access, and that is a must
for our community. Scaling up microtransit, when you look at, and I don't have the numbers on me, but
when you look at other communities that have done that, they are not seeing the same return on investment
as if they would scale up or increase route frequency on their fixed routes. The fixed routes are there,
because that is where we know people are going. Microtransit can fill in those gaps, but you as a transit
authority are paying much more per customer than what you would be paying per customer on a fixed route.
The amount of people who have ridden BT via microtransit is far and few between. Again,
I wrote it once last summer when they had the downtown shuttle. That was because I sprained my ankle
and I couldn't walk to work for a few days. There are situations in which, sure, that's great, but I'm
not making this a routine thing. The fixed routes are where we see the demand. That is what we should
be focusing our priorities on. Excellent. Excellent. Kind of as a follow-up to that a little bit, the
question is,
What is the one thing that's the largest problem with transit in Bloomington and how would you work
to change that as a board member? What I just heard you say was a couple of things. One was better route
frequency, and then you have these comments about microtransit. In the last few years, maybe a year
or two especially, it seems there's been a really big uptake locally in microtransit. How would you
as a board member impact some of that stuff that you just talked about in terms of
see a microtransit? Great question. And I'm not saying that I'm going to come in guns blazing on the
first board meeting and implement. Maybe the second. I understand it's about building relationships.
That's so much of what you all do as elected officials. That's what I do as a city staff member. It's
about building trust. And I know I have this expertise, but the board members don't know I have that.
I need to first have those conversations and I understand there are different rules about what conversations
you can have outside of public board meetings, but having those one-on-one conversations with board
members to just talk about my experience, what I'm seeing from my perspective in Bloomington because
everybody has a limited perspective. We all have these blinders on. My day job is to take off those
blinders and see other people's perspectives and so hopefully,
that can promote some good natured conversation and then eventually change. But I would like to push
BT at least somewhat away from scaling up microtransit and how I do that, again, I need people to work
with me. I don't know who that is, but it is about all in all, it's about building relationships and
then providing the evidence behind it. Again, I talked about
There are cities that have done this. Let's show them what cities have tried to do this, what's worked,
what's not worked, because I don't want to reinvent the wheel here. Transit is not new. I don't need
Bloomington to be innovative. I want us to look at the other cities that have either done something
right or done something wrong, and we can learn from that and go forward.
When you think about, and so sort of pulling the thread on a couple of comments, there are a lot of
different needs. So I wholeheartedly hear the argument that you focus first on where there's most demand,
right? But then you also noted that there are certain things that we have to do because there are diverse
needs. And so I'd love to elaborate a bit more on that.
How do we deal with this tension between where we get the most bang for our buck, if you will, versus
having a public service that meets the variety of public needs that exist? Yeah. I don't know if there
is a clear answer to that question. I'll be honest. It is a tough, tough balance in where to prioritize
your limited
funds and resources in a transportation authority, right? I don't know if I have much more than that
because it all comes down to listening to the community. That is what we as staff members, as officials
should be doing is listening to our community, but also using data to drive our decisions. Where is
the most bang for our buck? But also knowing that there is nuance
in what we do, that there should be these availability of different needs, but maybe we don't need to
scale it as big as we think we need to scale it. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Excellent. Thank you. I'm sorry. I'm
in a coffee shop, and they're grinding a bunch of things. Do you guys hear that? We can't hear it. We
can't hear it at all. Oh, good. OK. Because I'm like, this is going to go on a while. This just made
me want to circle back to the partnership
And I think as race director and like spending a lot of time at IU, like what do you think the future
looks like for like IU and BT? Right, anything kind of like your ideal situation or where you think
it like actually pragmatically might go if anywhere? One long-term goal I have for Bloomington Transit
is to merge with IU campus bus.
We have seen other college towns do that. Chapel Hill and a UNC bus did it. I think Kalamazoo and Central
Michigan did it recently. There's another one I'm thinking about too, but there has been this trend
of campus bus systems and city bus systems merging into one. One, because it's more efficient overall.
You have one umbrella, one organization making the transit system work. But two, and maybe more importantly,
You get more federal dollars. Transit authorities receive federal money based on ridership. And right
now, Bloomington Transit's ridership is X amount of riders, right? IU Campus Bus's ridership is X amount
of riders. Because Bloomington Transit cannot use those IU Campus Bus ridership in their total ridership,
they are not getting their, I'll put it in quotes, warranted federal funding for
buses for property, for BRT, whatever they want to spend it on. And so you see these other cities that
have combined their ridership upticks by X percent and they are able to get more federal funds. That's
the goal here. And I absolutely understand. IU has been approached with this before and they have not
been interested because they like control of their own bus system.
And so I don't know how that works in terms of creating that partnership to merge bus systems into one.
And maybe that's more on city council and the mayor and elected officials than board members, but there
could be a genuine citywide push to do that, create some pressure in some way, because it would
wholeheartedly benefit our community if these two bus systems combine into one.
Why do you think IU wants control? Why does IU want to retain control over its buses? That's a good
question. IU, and not just within transportation and transit, but they like to keep, whether it's property
or whether it's street ownership,
They like to have it, I think, for that, the lack of variability, maybe, that they can choose what to
do long term, and they can make those choices. They don't have to answer to anyone else. Where they
are the state, we are the city, and there is a bit of a, I think maybe, I don't know what to call it,
but there is definitely two partnerships, or two entities talking to each other.
but they don't necessarily have to answer to the city in some respects, and this is just one of them.
Awesome. Go on down to the bottom. This was mentioned earlier is bundled with another question, but
I'm going to bring it out more directly about the economic development-lit supplementation to BT, which
has gone on for
Five years, maybe four or five years, and this is technically the last year of it. And so what are your
views on what happens next with regard to that kind of like funding challenge and upcoming changes?
You know, they have a new management center coming on or right now or new management company. They're
working on building that new center on profile Parkway.
What is, just talk about those kinds of changes. You said you've been watching meetings. So I'm assuming
that you're at least a little in the know about some of these changes that are upcoming. So in terms
of the new property on Profile Parkway, I'm aware that they've been applying for federal grants for
that property and the new bus stations out there. And that is, again,
That's about what a 30 to $50 million project. And we're talking about what three and three and a half
million dollars, I think is what you said. So that is not even really a dent into that. And so it could
go to something there, but it could, we could also wait on that until BT receives a federal grant. Again,
that's an if, but usually they do receive federal funds in some way or another. And these funds could
go to improving
fixed routes in some way or another. That could be implementing shelters and accessible bus pads on
all fixed route stops. That could be buying new electric buses because it's in the strategic plan to
go zero emissions. And I think BTs may be about, oh, I'm going to get this number wrong, maybe about
40% of the way there, 30% of the way there. They are making progress, but it's a slow progress. And
so they could buy
two to three buses with that money. Really, I'm not going to prescribe solutions when I don't know all
of the options that staff have talked about because staff are the ones who are more knowledgeable about
this than anyone else. So I'd like to talk to staff before I prescribe solutions, but anything to improve
fixed routes would be preferable to me unless there are meaningful small purchases they can make with
that new headquarters.
Hey, did you have another question? Not right this second, actually. I'm good. Excellent. Is there anything
that we haven't asked you that you feel like we should ask you? Nope. Or anything else you'd like to
tell us? No, I think I'm good to go.
Excellent. Excellent. Thank you so much for, it's funny because the screens over here and the things
over here. So I am looking at you. Thank you so much for just all your service to the city and your
interest, obviously in being on this commission and wonderful ideas and energy towards this. Just so
very grateful for your time, Hank, and for everything you do. For sure. Hey, thank you all. I appreciate
it. Thank you. Talk soon. Thank you. Bye. Okay.
Great. So before we get thoughts, just a logistics question, are we going to do the fourth interview?
I don't remember who the fourth interview is anymore. It's Perry Mall. Excuse me, Perry Mall. He's out
of town this week and wanted to check availability for the week of next week, the week in the 17th.
You also have another application that just came through last night. Oh. It's Sharon Baker. Let's see.
So yeah, so what are thoughts about the more interviews? To be honest, I'm the one who said that we
should just interview all of them. I'm not really regretting that right now, because now what I hear
so far is that we have three good candidates. And I'm like, oh my god. Yeah.
I don't think we need to at least add anyone new to the pool that wasn't there before we started this
process. I think that's okay to say kind of, you know, we have four to consider. I think two, we can
consider the fourth whether or not we interview. There's the pretty in-depth application. I'm okay doing whatever.
And I remain, I think, in the same position, which is I feel very comfortable with all of these applicants.
I have some thoughts that might distinguish them slightly, depending on what we want to achieve. But
I would feel comfortable. And to your point, Kate, I also feel comfortable with the information given
to consider our fourth candidate as well.
Okay, well, so let's see what, what were, what were, what were your maybe first, we hear general thoughts
that they were all great, but what were, what were your maybe more specific thoughts first, Kate? I
think this is hard. I think they are all three pretty rock star candidates that bring three different
things that I would love on the board to the board. I think Kent has the,
Institutional knowledge, which is very useful. I think that has the ability to wrangle data and present
it very quickly. And I think has community perspectives. I think they're all great. What do you think?
Probably very similar in terms of all three of them being good at bringing slightly different things
to the board.
that could all be good things in terms of the candidate for next week. I'm just looking at applications
and remembering, yeah, this was another person who's similar to Kent, has had a lot of experience in
the field. I remember at the time going, would they be really similar? Because one of the things I'm
thinking about is this vote next Tuesday and Kent's words of like, depending on where that goes, we
may or may not be interested. I don't necessarily want to make a decision today because I do want to
see where that goes.
to see if one of our candidates takes themselves out of the pool. I also am interested in that question
of a five-member board versus a seven-member board and what the two of you think about that in terms of
Initial thoughts of that before I take that to the committee on council processes, because that could
be another piece. I know that we don't necessarily and I respect that. I can't remember which one of
you said it anymore. Not wanting to bring in another applicant from last night. But when I look at their
application, they're a regular access user. And so that also is.
potentially a relevant perspective and one that we talked about during one of the interviews yesterday
in terms of, it was Kent, I believe, in terms of a user with disabilities and a user of our
public transportation system. So just wanting to hear a little bit of what you guys think about that
seven versus five in terms of moving forward into the future and then maybe setting a meeting next week,
no matter what, maybe to interview Perry
as another one, and maybe just to be able to discuss the three that we have. Yeah. So I'm thinking first
on the question of seven versus five. I mean, I'll tell you that during the interview yesterday with
Kent, had we given hot reflections, right after the interview, I would have been like, okay, we should
increase this to seven, particularly because I was enjoying
the triangulation of them on sort of known problems, but new approaches to those problems. And so, but
of course, I think that the logistical difficulties associated with having a seven member board versus
a five member board, I think are something that we already had identified, but I don't know if
if this added value is enough to overcome the significant pain points that having seven people is likely
to cause. That being said, I think that I enjoyed, so first I sort of would put Hank and I like you
will say, I think across the three candidates so far, I think they all had a consistent view of the
problems. I think that
They just sort of were coming at it from different angles, which was really interesting to see. I don't
think they disagreed on the direction that we need to go in with BT. I think, though, that Hank viewed
it through the lens of the interface with the city, which I thought was interesting in other city programs.
That is a huge advantage to me. Where you started thinking about, we're doing all these other things
and how do we make sure that these things are being leveraged and aligned with what's going on with
BT, I think was a really good perspective. Now, other people like the city liaison can be presenting
that as well, but I just think that Hank is in a very good position to do that. Now, on the other hand
with Hank,
When asked the question about IU, I think that this is something that was telling about Kent and his
experience.
Kent understood having led IU transit for so long, and he said the exact same thing. He was like,
we need to, you know, merging would be a good idea. We'd make more money, et cetera, et cetera. But
then his perspective was, yes, but the things that we need to address are state issues, and we need
to address the fact that IU doesn't feel like we're going to deal with their students well. And actually,
that answer,
When and that's why I asked the question of Hank I was like, why do you think that is right in my he
didn't have the institutional awareness of what is the pain point if this is what we're trying to address
and so like if that was actually a direction we were trying to go in which of them.
Is better position to sort of help make progress in that position, maybe as can and then I think just
that generally his approach. I think that he he broke down very clearly, you know, with like three clear
points about like how he thinks about transit and how all decisions need to go through those lenses,
which I think the others echoed, but I just think he had the clearest sense of like, this is how you
make decisions about transit and this is what you prioritize. So, I mean, again, I think they're all
good. I might give a little bit of an edge to Zach. I think that only because I would have given it
to Kent, but I think that
My only, you know, obviously, as much as I hope that we're able to figure out some way to pull back
the contract signing, I don't know the likelihood or viability of that. And so, I mean, he's made fairly
clear that if we go with the new company, that he's not going to be on board. So, I mean, so maybe a
moot point, right? But assuming that that happened, that might have, you know, like 0.05 advantage to
him over the other two.
Um, thank you. That's really good. That's great to hear all that stuff. I think, um, to just like the
point of five or seven, why does my screen? It's like zooming in on me. I'm not doing anything. Um,
I, first I would wonder, I think for quorum issues, it's not that it doesn't change that much because
it's just one more person who has to be there out of two. I think it's okay. Um,
I do wonder if we're just not getting enough array of expertise with five. It just feels very hard that
I think there are skill sets that are missing on the five. I'm going to come back to that. But I think,
too, I would want to know, is it mayoral or is it council appointment? Because we don't know where the,
would it be one of each?
Yeah, one of each. I actually know that the state logic that it would be four mayoral appointments and
three council appointments right now. It's three mayoral and two council. And then it would still be
the one political party's orientation, one fewer. So we would need probably another Democrat. We need
one Democrat, one Republican, or one independent. Right. It could be a very interesting makeup then.
You could have a libertarian.
You could only ever have three Democrats potentially, and then like a Green Party, a Libertarian, and
it would be, it could potentially be very different, I guess. I do wonder about the skill sets, because,
right, I think, and I think, Hopi, I'm on your page that maybe we wait until after they have their meeting
on the third Tuesday, which is Tuesday.
just to see where Kent is. I think it is great that he's just honest with us, and I understand what
he's saying there. I think, too, I think about what I actually want on the board versus someone who
can weigh in on the board. So I think Hank's community perspective is very good. I think, too, he is
in an interesting position and a valuable
valuable position to BT that he works for the city. So he could be going to the meeting sometimes, like
they could have him as a guest, right? To like weigh in on things and wouldn't necessarily have to be
part of the board for that. I think Zach's ability to seriously like gather historical data and like,
I mean, the stuff he brought into us, you know, like,
Oh, I was looking at ridership over the years and this happened and that happened and this route went
away. And I was like pretty blown away I think by that. And that I think sometimes what I want to on
city council is someone who can kind of more objectively present something to me than like potentially
the administration or a council sponsor of an ordinance, right? And I think he would bring that. I mean, I just,
So I think in terms of these three, I lean probably like they're also very close, but like that can
tank. And I think too about having someone on the board who uses BT access. I again think about like,
I do like to have other people's perspectives, but I also think like a governing board member needs
to bring more for me than like just their transit experience. So,
Um, right. Like I, because I think we can get transit experience through like surveys or interviews.
Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I, one, one thought, and I asked this question, I probably, I didn't do a good
enough job of bringing this question up on the other two sides, but I did ask this question of Zach
and this was the one, um, I think minor,
minor weakness, pain point, I don't know. And I think that Hank maybe alluded to this, but in a different
way, which was like, yes, loving the position, loving the view, how do you use this position on BT to
affect that type, like the theory of change, I guess, right? It's like what, you know,
what does having you on this board mean for those outcomes and that clear connection? It may be something
that we need to do a little bit more thinking about so that whoever we appoint, that we can also give
them. And I think that actually this vote that Dr. Obermeyer sort of helped us identify illustrated
the need to give institutional
like strength, right, to the people on the board, because I think, you know, as it happens with council
as well, like we're in this situation a lot where like, where there's a thing we're allowed to do, but
we don't know how to do it, you know, and it's always late until you know what I'm saying. And so we
might at our next meeting, regardless of who we appoint, like think about having another meeting with
them so we can think through and maybe have like Larry, there are some things we can like talk through
about, okay, these are the type of things that can be achieved with this board. These are the type of
levers that you have. This is how you might approach these type of things.
And for that matter, we should meet with both or all three of our council appointees and talk through
some of those things a little bit. Is it three, two, that was three? Oh, okay, deal around, yeah.
So yeah. But anyway, so just adding that for the... We have three. Yeah, we have three. It's three,
two. I thought the mayor had three. No, it's us. We have three. I think we have Doug, Nancy and Kent.
Dog is one of ours, right? Yeah, okay. So that's I mean, just for just for just a thought about,
you know, like for aside from this exercise we're doing now, we should just chat with our board members
and get to know them a little better outside of this process. Do you all what do you all think about
just holding off until later next week?
I would like to do that personally. Yeah. I'm okay waiting because I think we should do the fourth interview.
We invited the person. I think it's, you know, we so. Yeah. As much as I'd be happy to appoint any of
these and the fact though that, you know, it's not, we're not going to face a quorum issue. Kenza is
going to be there for this Tuesday. Um, you know, so, so I think it's the only caveat is I'm not here
next week. So, um, so I'll be back. Let me see. Yeah, I think I'm in town all week next week.
Are you, can you zoom in, Isak or no? It's going to be very difficult to do that. Just zoom in in the
middle of the night. Oh, you're far away. Okay. Um, I mean, we do. Here's the thing. Kent is on the
board for 90 days. He is one of our top candidates in a way. It's not an extreme rush.
I think we would want to, oh, that's what you were saying. I think we would just want to appoint someone
by the next. We could actually appoint anybody until our September meeting anyway because we don't have
another regular council session until September. What I was going to say though is...
So it's not a limitation. I just, I just didn't like, because I am comfortable with all three of these
candidates. I'm comfortable on paper with Paul as well. If, if, if you all at the next meeting feel
so that we don't have to have a third meeting for all of us to deliberate about, like, I am very comfortable
with any one of these appointments. So like, I like appointments, you know, so, so like, yeah, sure.
Only if Hopi and I disagree then would you have to be in a meeting or also this is going to council. So we can
present it all to council and do a vote there as well, I think. Yeah. And what we could do then for
efficiency, I can watch the meeting, right? Yeah. And then just add a regular session during our regular
session. So Hopi and I will be in person to interview the fourth candidate, and then we can either make
a decision there or not. Yeah. And I think even if we don't disagree, I think that because the candidates
are really similar,
that your insight could be valuable anyway. I guess maybe I'm just feeling especially waffly today,
but I think that it's because all three of them are so good. They're good, exactly. I mean, think too,
they'll help you that this is just a recommendation. We can come to council with, we can present
what we have gone through here and have counsel decide as well. Like we don't have to have
a firm recommendation. Might I also say, so a thought is, oh, two thoughts. One is to check political
affiliation of the people who've applied because there's a possibility in which one of these few was
independent and or a Republican. I mean, unlike they'd be independent, but could be a Republican. If
we had two people,
All right, a Republican and a Democrat. Now the idea of expanding to seven makes sense. So I would be
I would be in favor of expanding if we had a candidate ready to go. Right. So so a different political
party. Exactly. Exactly. So so like if we if we had so, you know, if we had a Republican ready to go,
then I would say we should do the work of expanding. And then we essentially then would be appointing
two more people with a recommendation to the mayor. If we have, here's great people, here's one more
person you could appoint, just as an example. But we would be in an amazing position just imagining
that one of these people who has applied, including the person who just applied, would be
You know, it could be a Republican, in which case you already have three candidates, right? You know?
Or an independent, honestly, or a libertarian. But I mean, I think it's harder sometimes to show to
be independent in Indiana because that locks you out of all primaries. But I mean, I know when I was
door knocking, there were some people that said, yeah, I'm an independent, so I vote in primary. But
to be an independent, you either don't vote in the primaries or you can change who you vote for in the
primaries. Right. So you can all vote because primaries are
But I'm saying, if somebody has voted, could a person have voted, let's say they voted Democrat, then
Republican, Democrat, then Republican, does that make them an independent? Like the way that you look
at primaries, it's two primaries. I think we've looked at this before, and I think it has to be two
of the same consecutive ballots in your primary. Okay, but then how do you become an independent, Deanna?
Well, that's a good question. So would it not be that if you, over a period of four years, voted Democrat,
the Republican, Democrat, the Republican, or something like that? We'd have to check with legal on that
one, because we've not ran into that issue. And does not voting at all mean one is an independent? That
also seems like a cognitive leap now. Yeah, that's a good, I think it's basically
It's just an olive boy also is. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. Is this board within the city limits requirements?
Yeah, yes. Let's ask Larry or maybe about the, how are you an independent? Um, I, I know. I think, I
don't know.
I don't wanna talk about it right there, I think. I think there could be some candidates down the pipeline
to look at. And I almost still wonder, I mean, this doesn't have to be decided now, of course, about
the member board. I would wanna talk to the manager to see what they would think of it. And then, yeah,
I almost just think we're missing
There's missing skill tips that a normal governing board has. Not that the board members are inadequate,
it's only because it's a five-person board. It's really hard to get everything in there, I think. So
we could also just talk to council about it as well. Yeah, well, I'm going to bring it up in the CCP,
the Committee on Council Processes, because that tends to be where all these type two changes start.
is to see what they think about it. And I did mention it to Larry yesterday, just in terms of those
pros and cons, but also generally, I think one of the things that we also discussed in this session
was changing, like updating our Title II stuff around this word anyway, because some of the state guidelines
are not in our local guidelines and it's easier to look at our local versus the state stuff. And so
even if it just reflects what the state stuff says,
it might be easier to have it in our local code, depending on what it is. And so I have that up on my
computer. It's kind of on my to-do list to figure out what is our local code relying on, referring to
state code? And could we make our local code a little bit clearer and affirm self-responsibility? Especially
because we just asked the question, what levers can this work full? And that kind of stuff.
Yeah, also that's a I just I have the opposite perspective that I prefer to just refer to state code
because it can change. And so I like just a little C state code, you know, exactly. Yeah, I think I
think the B square asked the question about posting videos. Yeah, I just responded. I'm not certain.
And we've had this issue with cats before. It's like hodgepodge hit or miss as to why they
attend some meetings and then don't attend others. I'll get with cats to figure out if today's meeting
will also be uploaded and yesterday's, and hopefully we'll see it here on the website soon. They should
be a theory. Yes. Yeah. Right. Well, is it okay with you all if I adjourn? I've got to get to an 11.30.
Are we not deciding a different time for
Yeah, let's. It will definitely be easier to do that. Well, especially next week, Kate, it's really
you and I that need to make sure BISOC is 13 hours time difference. So what's good for you, Kate? And
it needs to be after Tuesday because that's what that meeting is. Next week, I can do Wednesday.
Okay. What time? All day. Okay. Honestly, that's, then I'm out, um, Thursday, Friday, or, it doesn't
matter, but I'm out. Okay. And then I could do the 24th. I mean, then I could look at the next week,
but that's just like my physical availability in town. Great. Um, Jennifer, what is the clerk schedule
like on the Wednesday? Um,
Let's see, because then we also like you need to contact. So it seems to be an interview to. I see.
Three probably would be the better time if possible. There's quite a few things that are happening in
the morning. And then there is a meeting with the PIO officers at one
to 215 that day. I could do late afternoon like that as well. So Kate, that would be good for you too,
like somewhere between like say three and five. Yeah. Anytime Wednesday is okay. Okay. Okay. So yeah,
if you could maybe reach out to- I'll check. Why am I blanking out his name again? Perry. Perry.
Perry Mall. Okay. To see if he's available on that Wednesday afternoon.
Okay, we can do that in our view and then we can debrief and. Okay, that sounds good. Okay. Yeah, sorry.
I forgot I have to leave. I'm not fine. Okay. Thing that I will say really quickly, because I know some
of y'all have to go yesterday. Another application just came through from the commission on the status
of black males to do the cloud.
Resigned originally and so, um, Vivian is a new applicant. I've talked or sent an email to, um, Crystal
Ritter, who is the state and civil city director to ask about this one. And she said her and Michael
Sharmas met with her to talk about, um, like what she wants to get involved in. And they highly recommend her for.
the commission on the status of black males. I just wanted to bring that to your attention. Perhaps
we can add that as a discussion item for next week and that will give us time to review that application.
I did see that that was advertised. Yes. Maybe there will be other applicants by next week too that
we need to consider. Does that sound good to you, Kate? Yes. Does that sound good to you too? I'm very
happy with Crystal. I'm happy to support their appointment.
Are we ready to adjourn now? Everybody okay? Uh huh, thank you all.