WEBVTT 00:00:00.866 --> 00:00:12.920 - We'll begin with a call to order and roll call. Thank you. Renard Cross. Jack Baker. Here. And my apologies. 00:00:12.920 --> 00:00:24.532 - Treasurer Butler. Present. Commissioner Castaneda. Here. Commissioner Duesner. Here. Commissioner Duffy. 00:00:24.532 --> 00:00:27.518 - Here. Commissioner Golden. 00:00:29.250 --> 00:00:39.781 - Chair Hackard, Commissioner Schlegel. Here. We have quorum. All right. Thank you. We'll move on into 00:00:39.781 --> 00:00:50.520 - approval of minutes. Does anyone have any comments on minutes? Any motions for changes to the minutes? 00:00:50.520 --> 00:00:59.070 - Or a motion for approval of minutes? So moved. All right. Thank you. I'll second. 00:00:59.266 --> 00:01:08.167 - All right, thank you. We have a motion to approve the minutes and a second. Would you please call the 00:01:08.167 --> 00:01:16.893 - roll? Certainly. And yes vote would be to approve the minutes from the July 23 meeting. Jack Baker? 00:01:16.893 --> 00:01:25.706 - Yes. And I apologize, co-chair Baker, treasurer Butler. That's all right. Abstain. Bye. Commissioner 00:01:25.706 --> 00:01:27.102 - Castaneda? Yes. 00:01:28.066 --> 00:01:35.108 - Commissioner Duesner? Yes. Commissioner Duffy? Yes. Commissioner Schlegel? Yes. The minutes have been 00:01:35.108 --> 00:01:42.289 - approved. All right, thank you. Minutes are approved. Moving on to staff review, let me read a document 00:01:42.289 --> 00:01:44.222 - here we always read before. 00:01:45.538 --> 00:01:51.170 - For each, this is a procedure for certificates of appropriateness and demolition delays. For each item 00:01:51.170 --> 00:01:56.637 - on the agenda, the historic preservation program manager will first present a staff report. We will 00:01:56.637 --> 00:02:02.433 - then hear if the petitioner has any additional information about the request, followed by public comment. 00:02:02.433 --> 00:02:07.955 - Once public comment concludes, commissioners will be able to ask questions to staff, the petitioner, 00:02:07.955 --> 00:02:08.830 - and the public. 00:02:09.378 --> 00:02:14.520 - We ask that petitioners, the public, and commissioners refrain from speaking until addressed by the 00:02:14.520 --> 00:02:19.867 - chair unless a question is directly addressed to them. Following commissioner questions, the chair will 00:02:19.867 --> 00:02:25.214 - then entertain a motion from a commissioner regarding the petition. Once a motion is made, we will then 00:02:25.214 --> 00:02:30.510 - open up the discussion of the item for members of the commission only. Finally, once the commissioners 00:02:30.510 --> 00:02:34.366 - have each had a chance to speak, the commission will vote on the petition. 00:02:34.594 --> 00:02:41.708 - We encourage all commissioners, petitioners, and members of the public to be civil and respectful at 00:02:41.708 --> 00:02:48.188 - all times. I'll pass it to you, Noah. Thank you, Vice Chair Baker. So our first certificate 00:02:48.188 --> 00:02:55.232 - of appropriateness for the evening is COA 2651, 4837 West 6th Street in the Near West Side Historic 00:02:55.232 --> 00:03:02.769 - District. Built in the 1970s, 837 West 6th is a gable front single story house with a brick veneer facade, 00:03:02.769 --> 00:03:03.966 - aluminum siding, 00:03:04.194 --> 00:03:13.617 - and a porch pediment on iron posts. This house is located on a corner lot with a detached garage in 00:03:13.617 --> 00:03:23.040 - the rear. The request is for the installation of a wooden picket style fence at four feet of height 00:03:23.040 --> 00:03:33.406 - to meet UDO standards. The fence will have two gates, one in the north and one on the west side of the house. 00:03:33.570 --> 00:03:40.730 - off the city sidewalk and opening inward onto the walkway approaching from the north. The fence will 00:03:40.730 --> 00:03:47.889 - be placed according to the following boundaries, west side of the property, inside the property line 00:03:47.889 --> 00:03:54.482 - approximately to the city right of way, and north along the south side of the sidewalk. Each 00:03:54.482 --> 00:04:00.862 - side approximately three feet west of the property line shared with the neighboring house 00:04:01.762 --> 00:04:12.875 - at 831 West 6th Street. The enclosed area is to be 700 square feet. And staff approves COA 2641. The 00:04:12.875 --> 00:04:23.988 - proposed fence meets standards for placement, height, and materials. Thank you. Next item, COA 2652. 00:04:23.988 --> 00:04:30.590 - This is 400 West 7th Street, the Johnson Creamery Building. 00:04:31.138 --> 00:04:38.466 - petitioner is Greg Elgar. Johnson Creamery is a two-story rectangular, building is a two-story rectangular 00:04:38.466 --> 00:04:45.314 - structure with a stepped parapet roof built in 1913. The conglomeration of added components signify 00:04:45.314 --> 00:04:52.231 - the large success of the operation and the end result is a 35,000 square foot industrial complex. In 00:04:52.231 --> 00:04:59.422 - the early years at West 7th Street, a two-story structure was built to the east of the original building 00:05:00.130 --> 00:05:06.210 - conforming in shape and orientation to the railroad tracks. A small boiler room and smokestack were 00:05:06.210 --> 00:05:12.715 - added just to the north of this addition. Another structure around 1923 enclosing the mechanical operation 00:05:12.715 --> 00:05:18.856 - of the company was built to connect the boiler room to the building. A one-story detached garage was 00:05:18.856 --> 00:05:24.936 - built in the early 1920s to the west of the main building and was connected to the main building in 00:05:24.936 --> 00:05:27.550 - 1927 with the completion of the ice house. 00:05:28.386 --> 00:05:36.128 - In 1949, the original smokestack was replaced with the current manifestation, which has been truncated 00:05:36.128 --> 00:05:43.869 - in the middle. The complex was further expanded in the 1950s with two-story additions to the southeast 00:05:43.869 --> 00:05:51.386 - and southwest, as well as the addition of a second story to the 1920s garage space. This request is 00:05:51.386 --> 00:05:55.294 - for the replacement of the acrylic Orion wall sign. 00:05:56.098 --> 00:06:04.946 - with a replacement that would be internally lit. Otherwise, same design, dimensions and attachment. 00:06:04.946 --> 00:06:14.059 - Any new holes that would be required would be made through mortar joints. And staff approved COA 2652. 00:06:14.059 --> 00:06:23.172 - Thank you. The new signage would imitate the existing signage in all respects, except for the addition 00:06:23.172 --> 00:06:25.118 - of internal lighting. 00:06:25.698 --> 00:06:34.060 - The plan makes use of existing mounting and the signage is located on a newer part of the building. 00:06:34.060 --> 00:06:42.589 - One more for me before I hand it over to you guys. COA 2653 for 112 West 6th Street in the Courthouse 00:06:42.589 --> 00:06:51.118 - Square Historic District. Petitioner here is also Greg Elgar. And the request is for the installation 00:06:51.118 --> 00:06:55.550 - of new 18-inch acrylic lettering over the storefront 00:06:56.066 --> 00:07:04.819 - to read edit and company. So this is the building that currently reads Bonfette, a notable neoclassical 00:07:04.819 --> 00:07:13.404 - commercial building with a limestone facade and staff approved COA 2653. The proposed lettering would 00:07:13.404 --> 00:07:22.157 - be mounted in the same location as existing lettering and would be very similar in design and materials 00:07:22.157 --> 00:07:24.766 - as well as fairly understated. 00:07:28.578 --> 00:07:41.332 - We'll move on then to commission review, starting with COA 26-50. OK. COA 26-50, 4701 South Eagleson 00:07:41.332 --> 00:07:52.318 - in the Elm Heights Historic District. Is anybody here present as petitioner? Mark, no. 00:07:57.858 --> 00:08:06.724 - My name is Martin Eagleboy, the homeowner. Hi. So 701 South Eagleson is a two-story limestone two-door 00:08:06.724 --> 00:08:15.332 - revival house with an overlapping gable entrance on the south end and a second story dormer window. 00:08:15.332 --> 00:08:24.543 - There are two additions with false half-timbering on the north and rear over an added cinder block garage. 00:08:24.543 --> 00:08:25.662 - This request 00:08:25.762 --> 00:08:33.616 - is looking to tear down and reconstruct an addition on the east side of the home, first level. This 00:08:33.616 --> 00:08:42.099 - addition is currently on top of the garage structure below with a partial coverage by a deck. The structure 00:08:42.099 --> 00:08:50.110 - has been compromised for water intrusion and this request would remove the first level portion of the 00:08:50.110 --> 00:08:55.294 - structure and replace most of it with a slightly larger addition. 00:08:56.194 --> 00:09:03.081 - This proposal would cover the rear entry to the deck, but not the second story windows. Limestone 00:09:03.081 --> 00:09:10.249 - wainscotting is proposed for the first floor rear addition. Is there anything else that the homeowner 00:09:10.249 --> 00:09:17.277 - would like to add? No, that sounds good. Okay. The recommendation from staff is for approval of COA 00:09:17.277 --> 00:09:24.094 - 2650. Located on the rear of the property, but visible from the street, the proposed addition is 00:09:24.258 --> 00:09:30.728 - Appropriately scaled to the property and complements the original structure and side addition and design 00:09:30.728 --> 00:09:37.074 - and materials Judging from aerial imagery the side and rear additions appear to have been added in the 00:09:37.074 --> 00:09:43.359 - 1960s Although the rear of the house has a long sorry has long had a second-story deck While the rear 00:09:43.359 --> 00:09:48.350 - door would be enclosed the plan calls for leaving the second-story windows uncut 00:10:00.066 --> 00:10:07.003 - Commissioner comments, questions at this point? Daniel, would you like to start us? It's questions? 00:10:07.003 --> 00:10:14.149 - Questions, yes. The one thing I was just going to ask Noah is if did the Elm Heights Historic District 00:10:14.149 --> 00:10:20.878 - wait? I see their guidelines. Sorry, I lost my word. But did they review it and did they provide 00:10:20.878 --> 00:10:27.816 - a recommendation? Yeah, I heard from one member of their design review committee who is actually in 00:10:27.816 --> 00:10:29.342 - the audience tonight. 00:10:29.794 --> 00:10:39.281 - And she had recommended approval as well. OK. But I had some questions about, I believe, the layout 00:10:39.281 --> 00:10:49.053 - of the limestone wainscoting and whether the proposed board and batten siding is going to resemble the 00:10:49.053 --> 00:10:58.730 - false half-timbering on the existing additions. OK. Perfect. Thank you, Noah. Commissioner Butler? No 00:10:58.730 --> 00:10:59.774 - questions. 00:11:00.738 --> 00:11:09.042 - Mr. Duffy? No questions. Mr. Duesner? No questions. No questions, thank you. All right. That leaves 00:11:09.042 --> 00:11:17.679 - the floor open for a motion. If someone is so inclined. Do you want to do a public comment? Do you want 00:11:17.679 --> 00:11:26.150 - to do a public comment? Oh, I'm sorry. That's my fault. I should have done that first. Yes. Would you 00:11:26.150 --> 00:11:30.302 - like to speak? Yes. This is for a public comment. 00:11:30.626 --> 00:11:38.039 - Yeah, I never did get the answers about my questions about the wainscoting going up the wall. I wasn't 00:11:38.039 --> 00:11:45.668 - sure that was up on the porch. It goes up to the windows. I wasn't sure that was. Is that what's intended 00:11:45.668 --> 00:11:53.009 - or is it just going to the bottom of the deck or is it going from the deck up to the windows? So from 00:11:53.009 --> 00:12:00.062 - what I had heard from the architect, it sounds like it's going to be above the cement garage, but 00:12:00.258 --> 00:12:07.744 - I'm sorry. From the deck level to the windows on the addition. So that's more 60s style? Like range 00:12:07.744 --> 00:12:15.454 - style? Is that the kind of weight toning you were thinking there? Because I said, we said we basically 00:12:15.454 --> 00:12:23.014 - support the, or I basically support the thing, but I had a little concern about the design there, if 00:12:23.014 --> 00:12:28.254 - it was appropriate to the house. The weight toning, not the addition. 00:12:31.298 --> 00:12:39.088 - That was the only question. Okay, well, I guess that's a comment too. Anyway, so you answered my question 00:12:39.088 --> 00:12:46.877 - that yes, it is going up to the top of the list. So, thank you. Would you state your name for the record? 00:12:46.877 --> 00:12:54.226 - Ah, okay. Virginia Southern. I live in Elm Heights Historic District and I'm on the Historic Review 00:12:54.226 --> 00:12:58.782 - Group. Thank you. Anyone else from the public? Anyone online? 00:13:04.514 --> 00:13:12.391 - All right, now we're looking for a motion, if you wish. I'll move that we approve. All right, we have 00:13:12.391 --> 00:13:20.731 - a motion for approval. Shouldn't we do Commissioner Comments first? I'm sorry? Shouldn't we do Commissioner 00:13:20.731 --> 00:13:28.222 - Comments first? We have a motion on the floor. You can second. We will do Commissioner Comments. 00:13:28.834 --> 00:13:42.050 - Once it's. Got you got. You second it all right. Let's start with Daniel. Commissioner Schlegel again 00:13:42.050 --> 00:13:55.525 - for comments. Yes, apparently I am second. I think it'd be good as long as it fits Elm Heights historic 00:13:55.525 --> 00:13:57.598 - district since. 00:13:58.114 --> 00:14:06.139 - We're here to support them. So if it falls into their regulations and Noah's review, I think I'd be 00:14:06.139 --> 00:14:14.324 - good with this. Thank you. Mr. Butler? Yeah, I mean, I think if Elm Heights is OK with this and if it 00:14:14.324 --> 00:14:22.429 - conforms to their standards, which I think it probably does, I think it would be maybe it seems like 00:14:22.429 --> 00:14:27.806 - the question wasn't necessarily answered as to what type of siting 00:14:28.322 --> 00:14:36.664 - It's going to have, is that true? Well, it's going to have board and batten siding. OK. Is that going 00:14:36.664 --> 00:14:44.925 - to match the style of the front? It's going to be similar to the style on the addition. I don't know 00:14:44.925 --> 00:14:53.512 - if they're going with the same paint colors that hasn't been answered yet, or similar. All right. That's 00:14:53.512 --> 00:14:55.966 - my only comments. Mr. Deffin? 00:14:57.442 --> 00:15:05.461 - Yes, I would support this proposal because the design review, which I'm happy that the design review 00:15:05.461 --> 00:15:13.717 - committee approves it, too. Just say in driving by, I couldn't see it at all from the front. The trees, 00:15:13.717 --> 00:15:21.974 - with the tree growth, of course, trees can be cut down. But it's really only visible from the adjoining 00:15:21.974 --> 00:15:25.150 - street. I mean, it's a corner property. 00:15:25.570 --> 00:15:36.374 - Just in case other people didn't see that, this view on the right is on the side street. And it's set 00:15:36.374 --> 00:15:47.284 - back. I don't think it's going to be any kind of a problem of obstructing the house at all. Thank you. 00:15:47.284 --> 00:15:54.910 - Commissioner Dues? No additional comments? I will support this project. 00:15:55.234 --> 00:16:05.522 - because they are supporting it. But I do agree with the fact that it is not clear enough what is happening. 00:16:05.522 --> 00:16:15.144 - Those questions that were brought up about how is this going to be finished, I think those are valid 00:16:15.144 --> 00:16:24.670 - questions because I don't see how that is going to be executed. Oh, this is new. OK. Thank you. OK. 00:16:24.866 --> 00:16:34.429 - That's all I have to say. Thank you for the additional information. I'm sorry, I forgot how many slides 00:16:34.429 --> 00:16:43.808 - there were. Thank you. It looks great. So did the commissioner comments? Well, I think we're ready to 00:16:43.808 --> 00:16:53.003 - call the roll. A yes would be affirmative for passing COA 26-50. OK, we'll go ahead and take a roll 00:16:53.003 --> 00:16:54.014 - call vote. 00:16:54.402 --> 00:17:04.160 - Vice Chair Baker? Yes. Treasurer Butler? Yes. Commissioner Capitanada? Yes. Commissioner Duesner? Yes. 00:17:04.160 --> 00:17:13.918 - Commissioner Duffy? Yes. Commissioner Schlegel? Yes. That motion passes 6-0. Thank you. Motion passes. 00:17:14.786 --> 00:17:22.979 - All right, before we move on, we will move on to demolition delay. But before we get into the first 00:17:22.979 --> 00:17:31.663 - one, I've been asked that staff and legal would like to make some explanatory comments. So we've received 00:17:31.663 --> 00:17:40.265 - or I received a question from a member of city council about the statement that is read after demolition 00:17:40.265 --> 00:17:41.822 - delay release that 00:17:43.458 --> 00:17:50.812 - I know Commissioner Butler has the language in front of him but says that the commission may designate 00:17:50.812 --> 00:17:58.166 - a property at a later point. And she was somewhat confused about that language I think understandably. 00:17:58.166 --> 00:18:05.378 - So we would like to come up with some revised language for that part of the statement. The answer to 00:18:05.378 --> 00:18:11.518 - what exactly that means is a little complicated because there's sort of a lot to what 00:18:12.866 --> 00:18:20.073 - release of demolition delay kind of means and what the one year period means and whether it's you know 00:18:20.073 --> 00:18:27.280 - partial demolition or full demolition but we will be coming up with something there to present to you. 00:18:27.280 --> 00:18:34.347 - Right and the question was also asked whether we were legally required to have this language because 00:18:34.347 --> 00:18:36.446 - it is kind of confusing right 00:18:36.578 --> 00:18:42.445 - And the answer is yes, it protects the city by putting on the record that the demolition permit is good 00:18:42.445 --> 00:18:48.255 - for one year. And after that one year, if the demolition is not done, that's when the commission could 00:18:48.255 --> 00:18:54.122 - go back and determine that they might want to designate it, right? So the permit does not last forever. 00:18:54.122 --> 00:18:59.763 - It's a finite period of time and everything resets if that permit elapses. It's the same thing with 00:18:59.763 --> 00:19:05.630 - the COA, right? You don't have the authority forever to do the thing that you got a limited time to do. 00:19:05.794 --> 00:19:14.575 - So it's important from a legal standpoint that that is clear whenever we give a demolition release so 00:19:14.575 --> 00:19:23.271 - that there's no expectation that someone can come back later and demolish it, or that it wouldn't be 00:19:23.271 --> 00:19:31.966 - designated later. Any questions? Thank you. Let's move in. I don't know if you would present DD25-1. 00:19:32.706 --> 00:19:41.430 - Okay, demolition delay 2511. This is for 216 North Lincoln Street. A petitioner is Ernest G. This is 00:19:41.430 --> 00:19:50.068 - for full demolition. 216 North Lincoln is a somewhat altered gable from bungalow built in 1920. The 00:19:50.068 --> 00:19:58.878 - house is fronted by a full width brick porch with two limestone planters and a limestone drain spout. 00:19:59.714 --> 00:20:06.511 - The windows and doors have been replaced and do not appear to be the original configuration. The house 00:20:06.511 --> 00:20:13.177 - has what appears to be an original basement garage door facing the alley to the south. This property 00:20:13.177 --> 00:20:19.908 - has frequently switched hands since the time it was built, passing from concrete mason Albert Funk to 00:20:19.908 --> 00:20:24.990 - stone sawyer Frank Riordan and his wife, the librarian Cora Riordan in 1923. 00:20:25.826 --> 00:20:32.902 - In the 1940s, the house was bought by the widow Helen Nunnally, who sold it in 1950, to bank teller 00:20:32.902 --> 00:20:39.979 - Robert Gray and his wife Liz. Liz began renting out spare rooms and sold the house in 1955 to Agnes 00:20:39.979 --> 00:20:46.560 - Martin, a widow who lived in the house until her death in 1977, renting out spare rooms. The 00:20:46.560 --> 00:20:51.230 - staff recommendation is for the release of Demolition Delay 2611. 00:20:53.666 --> 00:21:03.534 - Does the petitioner have anything that they would like to add? No, we don't. Thank you. All right. 00:21:03.534 --> 00:21:13.501 - Thank you. Well, let's go on to Commissioner Question. Any questions? Mr. Dealer? Mr. Duffy? I have 00:21:13.501 --> 00:21:20.478 - a question. Mr. Sandovales, when I read this and looked at the House, 00:21:20.642 --> 00:21:30.492 - I presume that the Sawyer made those limestone flower boxes. They look very homemade. I don't think 00:21:30.492 --> 00:21:40.637 - he would have had to have had any special fancy equipment other than just getting the materials there. 00:21:40.637 --> 00:21:49.502 - I guess I'd like to, well, first of all, ask you. You didn't see any notation about that. 00:21:49.730 --> 00:22:04.397 - Then my second question would be to Mr. C, if he maybe has talked to Steve Wyatt at BRI to see if he 00:22:04.397 --> 00:22:10.206 - might be interested in salvaging those. 00:22:13.858 --> 00:22:20.948 - I'm here on behalf of the petitioner, so I don't know for sure if he has or not, but I know he typically 00:22:20.948 --> 00:22:27.835 - does. Yes. And it's really fine with anything like that happening. Yeah. Yes, thank you. I appreciate 00:22:27.835 --> 00:22:34.790 - that. If I may ask, I don't want to speak out of turn, but BRI, have they had a look at the agenda for 00:22:34.790 --> 00:22:41.744 - this meeting? I just wanted to know what it is. I don't know. OK. I don't know if he has. He typically 00:22:41.744 --> 00:22:42.622 - does, Steve. 00:22:42.754 --> 00:22:54.149 - typically does, but I can't speak for him because I haven't talked to him. Thank you. Commissioner Butler? 00:22:54.149 --> 00:23:05.012 - No. Commissioner Schlegel? All right. Any more questions? I think we are ready to put a motion on the 00:23:05.012 --> 00:23:12.254 - floor if you so desire. These are always hard. Any public comments? 00:23:12.450 --> 00:23:23.395 - Yes. Would anyone like, from the public, would like to speak to this demolition delight? Anyone online? 00:23:23.395 --> 00:23:34.760 - Very no one? I'm sorry, were you? Yeah, I was just going to comment. The only thing I was- Adonify yourself 00:23:34.760 --> 00:23:38.654 - again. I'm sorry. Virginia Southern. 00:23:38.786 --> 00:23:44.805 - I was just going to comment on the limestone boxes. I was going to say the same thing. And I actually 00:23:44.805 --> 00:23:50.765 - know several houses that have the hangers sticking out, but their boxes are gone. So there is a need 00:23:50.765 --> 00:23:56.843 - around town if there are original pieces. I'm sure there's some people that would like to replace them 00:23:56.843 --> 00:24:02.980 - back on the truck. I guess what happens is they're wet. They fill up with water in the winter, and then 00:24:02.980 --> 00:24:08.350 - there goes the limestone. So yeah, they're missing on a lot of houses. So those are great. 00:24:09.218 --> 00:24:22.676 - That's the only comment. Thank you. All right, now we're ready for a motion. I would put a motion on 00:24:22.676 --> 00:24:36.400 - the floor to having a senior moment. The motion to agree with the comments from the staff and a motion 00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:39.198 - to release DD 26-11. 00:24:44.802 --> 00:24:53.508 - All right, let's call a roll. Comments, sorry. Comments again, please. It's the kind of small housing 00:24:53.508 --> 00:25:02.214 - stock with local character that I like to see torn down, especially when, I mean, I can't see what it 00:25:02.214 --> 00:25:11.091 - looks like on the inside, but I mean, somebody's obviously put a new roof on this in recent years. It's 00:25:11.091 --> 00:25:12.286 - just a shame. 00:25:12.514 --> 00:25:22.011 - I realize that goes beyond the purview of the HPC, but I always like to take the opportunity to mention 00:25:22.011 --> 00:25:31.142 - it. Yeah, thank you. Mr. Duffy? No. No comments. Mr. Butler? No. Mr. Schlage? I agree with what Mr. 00:25:31.142 --> 00:25:40.274 - Duesner said. I think it's a shame. So a yes vote is for releasing DD 2611, if you'd call the roll. 00:25:40.274 --> 00:25:41.278 - Certainly. 00:25:42.178 --> 00:25:50.917 - We'll go down with the roll call vote here. Vice Chair Baker? Yes. Treasurer Butler? Yes. Commissioner 00:25:50.917 --> 00:25:59.486 - Castaneda? Yes. Commissioner Duesner? Yes. Commissioner Duffy? Yes. Commissioner Schlegel? Yes. That 00:25:59.486 --> 00:26:08.309 - motion passes 6-0. All right. Motion passes. I think I have a document. We normally read like anything. 00:26:08.309 --> 00:26:10.430 - Oh, John's reading good. 00:26:11.298 --> 00:26:18.611 - Today, regarding the property located at 216 North Lincoln Street, the Historic Preservation Commission 00:26:18.611 --> 00:26:25.924 - declares that it got notice of proposed demolition and after today's discussion, sees no need to review 00:26:25.924 --> 00:26:32.955 - the plans any further and waives the rest of the demolition delay waiting period. The HPC may later 00:26:32.955 --> 00:26:40.268 - recommend the property for historic designation to the Common Council. Thank you. All right, let's move 00:26:40.268 --> 00:26:41.182 - on to DD 26. 00:26:41.378 --> 00:26:49.989 - This is Demolition Delay 2612 for 3420 East Adair Lane, which is a modernist. This is a partial demolition. 00:26:49.989 --> 00:26:58.441 - I should preface. A modernist 1964 A-frame with a brick and frame construction, a floor-to-ceiling window 00:26:58.441 --> 00:27:06.494 - taking up half of the street facing N Gable. A vertical wood shed stands to the east of the building 00:27:06.494 --> 00:27:11.198 - under a shed roof that extends from the roof of the house. 00:27:12.802 --> 00:27:22.453 - The proposal for partial demolition includes alterations to the patio and entry on the west ledge facing 00:27:22.453 --> 00:27:31.645 - the house. Demolition of the existing shed and carport and replacement with an extended carport and 00:27:31.645 --> 00:27:39.550 - slightly larger vertical, vertically sided wood shed slightly further from the house. 00:27:41.794 --> 00:27:59.625 - and the addition of a second story window on the west elevation. Walk through some of these. From 1964 00:27:59.625 --> 00:28:10.878 - until 2024, this house was the residence of Stein and Leon Levy. 00:28:11.074 --> 00:28:18.098 - and later Stein's second husband, Albert Koch. Born in Germany in 1927, Stein's family fled to the US 00:28:18.098 --> 00:28:25.122 - in 1933. Stein was an active member in the NAACP and a practicing developmental psychologist into her 00:28:25.122 --> 00:28:32.077 - 80s, specializing in autism treatment. Stein's first husband, Leon Levy, taught in the IU psychology 00:28:32.077 --> 00:28:38.206 - department for 24 years, serving as the director of clinical training for nine of those. 00:28:38.946 --> 00:28:46.419 - Leon authored over 60 published articles and was awarded several HHS grants for research on clinical 00:28:46.419 --> 00:28:54.262 - practice. He moved to Maryland in 1978. In 1983, Stein remarried Indiana University bacteriologist Arthur 00:28:54.262 --> 00:29:02.179 - Koch. Over the course of his career, Koch authored over 250 papers and received numerous awards, including 00:29:02.179 --> 00:29:06.174 - a Guggenheim Fellowship, a Rockefeller Scholar Award, 00:29:06.946 --> 00:29:14.461 - a welcome research travel grant and a U.S. Public Health Service Award. The recommendation from staff 00:29:14.461 --> 00:29:22.197 - is the release of demolition delay 26-12. The proposed alterations are sympathetic to the house's design 00:29:22.197 --> 00:29:29.712 - and the design of the existing carport and shed. The changes to the west of the house would be fairly 00:29:29.712 --> 00:29:36.638 - minor. And I will say I did receive a comment from a neighbor who expressed concern about the 00:29:37.250 --> 00:29:49.334 - septic field at this property, which after some recent work has apparently been leaking into the water 00:29:49.334 --> 00:30:01.652 - supply of the neighboring property and wanted to know what the effect of, you know, the changes proposed 00:30:01.652 --> 00:30:05.758 - to the house and carport might be. 00:30:05.890 --> 00:30:15.734 - Have any comments you'd like to make? Yes, I do. I would like to note that the carport and the porch, 00:30:15.734 --> 00:30:26.253 - as you can see in the photos on the left, are failing significantly structurally, and they need remediation. 00:30:26.253 --> 00:30:35.614 - So that's part of why we are redoing these areas. That's all. Thank you. Public comment on this? 00:30:36.098 --> 00:30:43.993 - Please stand and give us your name. My name is Susan and my mom lives next door and I think the house 00:30:43.993 --> 00:30:51.966 - is beautiful and I think the people who lived there were very nice. I grew up with a daughter who grew 00:30:51.966 --> 00:30:59.938 - up in the house but I am not concerned with the renovations themselves. I'm concerned with the removal 00:30:59.938 --> 00:31:01.022 - of the septic 00:31:01.250 --> 00:31:08.996 - field and the septic holding tank. I just want to make sure that it's very carefully monitored so that 00:31:08.996 --> 00:31:17.269 - it doesn't leak into my mother's property. My mother was next door. She's 93. She's a widow. She's recovering 00:31:17.269 --> 00:31:24.790 - from a stroke. So I just want to make sure that her health and safety goes into consideration. It's 00:31:24.790 --> 00:31:30.430 - not just the beauty of the home. It's also the removal of the septic field 00:31:30.946 --> 00:31:38.647 - which I'm sure you might want to explain to them what a septic field is if they don't know. I myself 00:31:38.647 --> 00:31:46.577 - didn't know and I had to research it. And it said in the United States EPA that the removal of a septic 00:31:46.577 --> 00:31:54.354 - field and the removal of a septic holding tank is a very sensitive issue and needs to be handled with 00:31:54.354 --> 00:32:00.606 - care and carefully monitored. So that's my concern for my mother who lives there. 00:32:00.706 --> 00:32:08.862 - next door and whose property not only borders the property, but is under the property. So anything that 00:32:08.862 --> 00:32:16.940 - might leak might leak into her property, which is my concern. But I think the house is beautiful. It's 00:32:16.940 --> 00:32:24.861 - always been beautiful. I'm just concerned about the removal of the septic tank, septic holding tank, 00:32:24.861 --> 00:32:27.998 - and the removal of all of the different 00:32:28.258 --> 00:32:38.342 - little tubes and pipes under the ground contained which of the 70 or maybe, is it 75 year old septic 00:32:38.342 --> 00:32:48.626 - field? I'm not sure if it's been years or 75. Since 1953 maybe, 1957. Could be. And I'm also concerned 00:32:48.626 --> 00:32:53.918 - about the removal of the water pipe that seems to be 00:32:54.274 --> 00:33:01.699 - belonging to them that seems to be in my mom's yard because that would involve digging up my mom's yard 00:33:01.699 --> 00:33:09.124 - and I want to make sure that's handled with care as well. Thirdly, this isn't a health and safety issue 00:33:09.124 --> 00:33:16.406 - but the border itself, I want to make sure before any digging begins that the property border between 00:33:16.406 --> 00:33:23.902 - the two properties is agreed upon with both surveyors so before they start removing my mother's trees or 00:33:25.026 --> 00:33:34.078 - the landscape that was designed by Designscape because my parents spent a lot of money on it and they 00:33:34.078 --> 00:33:42.953 - thought it was on their property and if it's not on their property, I understand completely, but if 00:33:42.953 --> 00:33:52.537 - it is on my mom's property, of course, I wouldn't want it to be destroyed. It seems to me that the proposed 00:33:52.537 --> 00:33:54.046 - plan to have the 00:33:54.754 --> 00:34:04.282 - the new carport very, very close to the property's edge, perhaps within the, not on the border exactly, 00:34:04.282 --> 00:34:13.718 - maybe, but certainly within the setback area. So we just want to make sure that we are all on the same 00:34:13.718 --> 00:34:22.880 - page as to where the property border is, agreed upon by both the both parties' surveyors and before 00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:24.254 - the demolition 00:34:24.514 --> 00:34:31.211 - I'm sorry to take up so much time. And I've done this before, but I just want to make sure that my mom's 00:34:31.211 --> 00:34:37.654 - protected. Thank you. She lives alone in her home. My dad died in 2018. And it's hard enough to live 00:34:37.654 --> 00:34:43.649 - alone when you're that age. But to live alone with a stroke is even harder. And to live alone 00:34:43.649 --> 00:34:50.091 - in a construction site is going to be hard. But as long as we know that my mom can put up a fence or 00:34:50.091 --> 00:34:54.046 - something and protect herself from that on her property, then 00:34:55.394 --> 00:35:04.648 - That's okay. I just want to make sure health and safety is considered. Yes, thank you. Appreciate the 00:35:04.648 --> 00:35:13.901 - comments. I can give a rough idea of what a septic field is to people who might not know, and that is 00:35:13.901 --> 00:35:23.518 - it's run off into, it's on a private property where one runs the effluent, the sewage from the house into 00:35:23.906 --> 00:35:32.831 - piping and into a settling basin on the property, unconnected to the city sewer, and common in the country. 00:35:32.831 --> 00:35:40.847 - I grew up with one. And it uses the ground to soak in some of the liquids and the settling tank, 00:35:40.847 --> 00:35:49.194 - the solids. And I know they have to be cleaned every so often. And I don't know the life of one, but 00:35:49.194 --> 00:35:53.822 - I understand they can get quite old and they can crack. 00:35:54.466 --> 00:36:02.405 - Am I getting at it, or do you have more comments, please? Yeah, that's exactly how they function. 00:36:02.405 --> 00:36:10.750 - I believe, and for the record, I will be abstaining from voting because this is coming from my office. 00:36:10.750 --> 00:36:19.094 - And Erica is representing, and she's the lead designer on this project. But I can add to your comments 00:36:19.094 --> 00:36:23.550 - about the septic field. Yes, it's an old septic field. 00:36:23.938 --> 00:36:31.368 - all septic fields have the potential to fail. In this case, there is a city connection to it, and I 00:36:31.368 --> 00:36:39.393 - believe we're making the effort to tap into the city. And this septic field will be abandoned and carefully 00:36:39.393 --> 00:36:47.194 - taken care of. So I just wanted to let you know that we're taking care of this very carefully and taking 00:36:47.194 --> 00:36:52.990 - into consideration all the matters that you just mentioned about your mother. 00:36:54.434 --> 00:37:00.281 - The other concern is that on the other side- I'm sorry, we are done now with public comment. Oh, I think- 00:37:00.281 --> 00:37:05.908 - I certainly appreciate what you had to say. And there was another question I believe you had. I'm not 00:37:05.908 --> 00:37:11.590 - retaining it at the moment. I wanted to try to answer you though. I think it was about property loans. 00:37:11.590 --> 00:37:17.106 - I was just going to talk about the water, the public, the water behind the property. I want to make 00:37:17.106 --> 00:37:22.953 - sure when the- I want to confirm that when the removal of the septic field and the septic tank are taking 00:37:22.953 --> 00:37:24.222 - place that none of the 00:37:24.642 --> 00:37:33.322 - leakage goes into the public water where children play and where animals drink. Yeah, absolutely. All 00:37:33.322 --> 00:37:42.172 - that procedure has very strict requirements to do for it to happen. It will be carefully done. Is there 00:37:42.172 --> 00:37:45.406 - someone monitoring it, overseeing it? 00:37:46.530 --> 00:37:52.408 - I cannot tell you who that person is, but I'm sure there is. I mean, we have a whole... I believe the 00:37:52.408 --> 00:37:58.285 - application said city and Bloomington utilities asked to... Yeah, cities involved as well. Thank you. 00:37:58.285 --> 00:38:04.393 - That's what I wanted to sort of give you a hard answer on this. This commission is not strictly concerned 00:38:04.393 --> 00:38:08.254 - with that, but we'll be passing it along to the proper people that 00:38:08.482 --> 00:38:15.340 - would be involved with. We wouldn't normally do property lines, that sort of thing. That's not our purview. 00:38:15.340 --> 00:38:22.008 - And septic systems, but I want to give you sort of a rough answer on a couple of things. But these would 00:38:22.008 --> 00:38:28.421 - go back through NOAA and go back into city divisions. And they would have to control then how things 00:38:28.421 --> 00:38:34.962 - are being dug, how it's being handled. And they would control how the septic system. But if it's being 00:38:34.962 --> 00:38:37.502 - abandoned, we have no real issue there. 00:38:37.954 --> 00:38:48.502 - But we have a different criteria we have to use here. But I hope we gave you some answer on your issues. 00:38:48.502 --> 00:38:58.748 - I think at this point, we're ready to ask questions from commissioners. Melanie, let's start with you 00:38:58.748 --> 00:39:05.278 - this time. I was just going to ask, and you've already answered, 00:39:05.858 --> 00:39:13.102 - who will be the responsible body for overseeing this. And just to make sure that, can we make sure before 00:39:13.102 --> 00:39:20.140 - we finish our discussion of this, that the petitioner, well, the neighbor of the petitioner feels that 00:39:20.140 --> 00:39:27.110 - she has a good sense of who will be monitoring this. But City of Bloomington, you've already answered 00:39:27.110 --> 00:39:33.534 - that question, so my question is answered. Mr. Duffy. No questions. Mr. Butler. Mr. Schlegel. 00:39:35.586 --> 00:39:52.524 - I have no further comments. Let's at this point open the floor to motion. I'll move we release DD 2612. 00:39:52.524 --> 00:40:04.414 - I'll second that. Thank you. Let's go within the Commission of Comments. 00:40:05.058 --> 00:40:17.379 - Let's start with you again. No further comments. This seems like it's been well thought out and a bunch 00:40:17.379 --> 00:40:30.174 - of the questions have been answered, whether they're in our review or not. So I think this is a responsible 00:40:30.174 --> 00:40:34.558 - project. I have no further comments. 00:40:35.650 --> 00:40:46.099 - There's a motion on the floor on DD 2612 that has also been seconded. We'll take a roll call vote. Vice 00:40:46.099 --> 00:40:57.151 - Chair Baker? Yes. Treasurer Butler? Yes. Commissioner Castaneda? Yes. Commissioner Duesner? Yes. Commissioner 00:40:57.151 --> 00:41:02.878 - Duffy? Yes. Commissioner Schlegel? Yes. That passes five 00:41:03.330 --> 00:41:14.291 - One, zero, that one being an abstention. All right. Motion passes. Do I need to read the release of 00:41:14.291 --> 00:41:25.581 - that? Yes. Even though it's a partial. Today, regarding the property located at some address. Oh, 3420 00:41:25.581 --> 00:41:27.006 - Nista Dayer. 00:41:27.170 --> 00:41:34.249 - 3420 East Adair, the Historic Preservation Commission declares that it got notice of proposed partial 00:41:34.249 --> 00:41:41.259 - demolition and after today's discussion, sees no need to review the plans any further and waives the 00:41:41.259 --> 00:41:48.129 - rest of the demolition delay waiting period. The HPC may later recommend the property for historic 00:41:48.129 --> 00:41:55.486 - designation to the common council. All right, thank you. Then let's move along to demolition delay 26-13. 00:41:56.674 --> 00:42:04.480 - By demolition delay 2613, this is 403 North Dunn Street. Petitioner is Ernest G. 403 North Dunn Street 00:42:04.480 --> 00:42:12.210 - is a one and a half story cross gabled bungalow with a full width brick front porch with tapered wood 00:42:12.210 --> 00:42:20.091 - posts. Original three over one and five over one windows and shake siding on the upper level. The house 00:42:20.091 --> 00:42:24.638 - was likely built in the early 1920s and no later than 1927. 00:42:25.058 --> 00:42:31.871 - replacing an earlier shotgun-style house. While it is difficult to determine the first occupant and 00:42:31.871 --> 00:42:38.821 - exact year the house was built, a firefighter named Albert Bender was the first owner-occupant of the 00:42:38.821 --> 00:42:45.839 - property in 1925 and seems like a likely candidate for the builder. Like earlier occupants of the lot, 00:42:45.839 --> 00:42:52.652 - the Benders only stayed for a couple of years, and by 1960, the house had been home to more than 10 00:42:52.652 --> 00:42:53.470 - households, 00:42:54.114 --> 00:43:00.966 - of retirees, teachers, stone planers, and university employees. From 1960 until 1995, the house was 00:43:00.966 --> 00:43:08.160 - owned by mailman Howard Shiflett Jr. and his wife Peggy. A veteran of the Korean War, Harold, I'm sorry, 00:43:08.160 --> 00:43:15.355 - not Howard Shiflett, Harold Shiflett. A veteran of the Korean War, Harold also volunteered as a baseball 00:43:15.355 --> 00:43:16.862 - and football referee. 00:43:18.338 --> 00:43:24.953 - From 1953 through 1960, the house was home to the family of John P. Sheehan and his wife Eleanor. Of 00:43:24.953 --> 00:43:31.567 - all the residents, Sheehan has left the largest record, the head producer of IU Radio and Television 00:43:31.567 --> 00:43:38.378 - from 1953 to his death in 1968. Sheehan was a popular speech and media professor and announcer and host 00:43:38.378 --> 00:43:45.320 - on Bloomington and IU radio and TV programs. Described by his department chair as someone of his showman, 00:43:45.320 --> 00:43:47.678 - Sheehan hosted several radio shows, 00:43:48.450 --> 00:43:56.873 - announced events including Little 500 and Campus Quiz Bowl and performed in university theater productions. 00:43:56.873 --> 00:44:04.283 - After his untimely death in 1968, the School of Journalism, a School of Journalism scholarship 00:44:04.283 --> 00:44:12.862 - was established in his name. The staff recommendation is for the release of Demolition Delay 2613. Generally, 00:44:14.146 --> 00:44:21.004 - When a property is evaluated for its association with a significant individual, and this is how it's 00:44:21.004 --> 00:44:28.133 - handled for national register criterion B, so that's sort of my background here, it is compared to other 00:44:28.133 --> 00:44:35.534 - buildings associated with that person's accomplishments and its significance for that person's contributions 00:44:35.534 --> 00:44:42.528 - is considered. As was the case with the home of David A. Randall, director of the Lilly Library at 326 00:44:42.528 --> 00:44:43.614 - South Eagleson, 00:44:44.098 --> 00:44:50.908 - which is another demolition delay that we considered earlier this year. This was a residence of an individual 00:44:50.908 --> 00:44:57.532 - who had a significant impact on the community, whose work is more closely associated with another existing 00:44:57.532 --> 00:45:03.289 - property. In this case, the radio television slash fine arts building at Indiana University, 00:45:03.289 --> 00:45:09.479 - built in 1963, which is a closely associated with a role that John P. Sheehan played in shepherding 00:45:09.479 --> 00:45:11.646 - IU's radio and television program. 00:45:13.058 --> 00:45:21.052 - For one of his Bloomington residences to also be eligible for its association, the significance of this 00:45:21.052 --> 00:45:28.968 - house to his career accomplishments would have to be established. It is possible that further research 00:45:28.968 --> 00:45:36.654 - could yield proof of an association between this house and Sheehan's career, but so far it has not. 00:45:36.654 --> 00:45:40.190 - Thank you. Does the petitioner wish to speak? 00:45:47.458 --> 00:45:56.730 - We don't have anything to add, thank you. All right, thank you. I did add a comment about 216 North 00:45:56.730 --> 00:46:05.723 - Lincoln to the chat, if you guys want to read that, but I don't have anything about Dunn Street. 00:46:05.723 --> 00:46:15.088 - All right, thank you. At this point, is there anything anyone from the audience or online would like 00:46:15.088 --> 00:46:17.406 - to say? Hearing nothing? 00:46:17.602 --> 00:46:27.259 - We'll move on to Commissioner questions. No questions. No questions. Commissioner Guzman. Is the front 00:46:27.259 --> 00:46:36.916 - of that porch severely bowed, or is that just a bad photograph? I think that's just whatever skew from 00:46:36.916 --> 00:46:47.230 - the... This was a Google Stradia photo. It's got like the fish. Mr. Duffy. No questions. Commissioner Butler. 00:46:47.618 --> 00:46:54.846 - Mr. Schlegel. As usual, I struggle with these. And part of it is, I know I'm not going to be as famous 00:46:54.846 --> 00:47:01.933 - as the guy that lived here or anything, but for me, most of the time, I do stuff at my house as much 00:47:01.933 --> 00:47:09.302 - as I would do it at a place of work. So his connection would be, this would be where a lot of his, maybe 00:47:09.302 --> 00:47:16.670 - he didn't do the physical work, but maybe a lot of it came from here. So that's where I'm struggling is, 00:47:19.842 --> 00:47:26.216 - it feels like kind of like wholesale destruction of local homes or what made Bloomington Bloomington 00:47:26.216 --> 00:47:32.526 - or the people like this IU professor but I also understand that's incredibly I mean I have no doubt 00:47:32.526 --> 00:47:38.836 - Noah's done a great amount of research so I'm not going to question that whatsoever and I know that 00:47:38.836 --> 00:47:45.210 - can be incredibly difficult because it's not documented it's not like someone unless his journals he 00:47:45.210 --> 00:47:49.438 - wrote down this is what I did at my house and then sent it at work 00:47:50.178 --> 00:48:04.892 - we're not going to know. So it's just, it's a shame. Thank you. Well, at this point we are open to a 00:48:04.892 --> 00:48:18.878 - motion, a number of ways we could go here, but one would like to put a motion on the floor. No, 00:48:20.130 --> 00:48:27.364 - Have you, in your research, I mean, do you feel like you've fairly well exhausted everything, or do 00:48:27.364 --> 00:48:34.671 - you feel that there's anything left where you can? So, I'll sort of walk you through the main places 00:48:34.671 --> 00:48:42.340 - I checked. I started with newspapers for this one, which even through the time period where the Sheehan's 00:48:42.340 --> 00:48:46.174 - lived here, there will be occasionally references to 00:48:47.170 --> 00:48:55.335 - events at the house, whether people are coming or going from town. The one bit of work that I saw referenced 00:48:55.335 --> 00:49:02.825 - by a resident of this house in the newspaper was his son came up with an idea for a dog-powered car 00:49:02.825 --> 00:49:10.016 - that he wanted to sell to the police. After that, I checked out IU Archives, which has a couple 00:49:10.016 --> 00:49:16.158 - of collections related to radio television and to John Sheehan more specifically. 00:49:16.898 --> 00:49:28.642 - I saw information, a handful of newspaper clippings in there, letters related to his promotion to producer, 00:49:28.642 --> 00:49:40.059 - stuff from his funeral. I didn't really see any references to things taking place at his house. He lived 00:49:40.059 --> 00:49:46.366 - here for approximately like most of the first half of his 00:49:46.818 --> 00:49:55.115 - time in IU, then he moved to another house up in, not Mailock Heights, but other neighborhood up there. 00:49:55.115 --> 00:50:03.172 - It's not quite as cool as this one. Yeah, I did it. Most of the extracurricular stuff not related to 00:50:03.172 --> 00:50:11.230 - RTV was stuff that he did with other radio stations or with community theaters, what it looked like. 00:50:16.258 --> 00:50:25.707 - I will put a motion on the floor with some comments attached. The motion is to release DD 26-13, the 00:50:25.707 --> 00:50:35.157 - comments that if someone feels strongly about trying to designate, motions can be withdrawn. I could 00:50:35.157 --> 00:50:44.606 - withdraw that motion. But I'm doubting that with the information we have, it would meet the criteria 00:50:44.994 --> 00:51:03.398 - for designation, so the motion stands. Does anyone want to second or not? If I want to, but I will just 00:51:03.398 --> 00:51:13.662 - to move this along. So I'll second. Thank you. All right. 00:51:13.890 --> 00:51:22.307 - and we're ready for Commissioner Comments. Let's start with you, Commissioner Schlegel. Yeah, I mean, 00:51:22.307 --> 00:51:30.641 - I think it's unfortunate that this smaller to mid-scale housing is going to be torn out for whatever 00:51:30.641 --> 00:51:35.262 - purpose we can consider. That's going to be overpriced. 00:51:36.706 --> 00:51:43.212 - I just looking through the neighborhood, I feel that there's a lot of other rentals and trying to get 00:51:43.212 --> 00:51:49.718 - a single designation on its own past city council is I think it's snowballed to have a better chance, 00:51:49.718 --> 00:51:56.352 - you know, where I just don't think it's going to be possible. And with the sheer amount of rentals that 00:51:56.352 --> 00:52:02.986 - are there, I don't know if they'd be able to even contact some of those owners. Thank you. Commissioner 00:52:02.986 --> 00:52:06.558 - Butler. Um, not like this house on the boat. No, that's 00:52:06.786 --> 00:52:16.184 - Follow me on the second. Mr. Duffy. No comments. Mr. Duesner. I just noticed that this may just be an 00:52:16.184 --> 00:52:25.582 - error. But just as an FYI, the packets, the digital version of the packets, are no longer listing who 00:52:25.582 --> 00:52:34.796 - the petitioner is and some of those small details there. I think it would be good to have that full 00:52:34.796 --> 00:52:35.902 - information 00:52:37.058 --> 00:52:49.984 - digital versions. And I hate seeing this. It doesn't sound necessarily like when we're going to have 00:52:49.984 --> 00:53:03.038 - the grounds to protect. Unless somebody sees an avenue here that I don't. And I noticed another error 00:53:03.038 --> 00:53:05.470 - on the background. 00:53:05.858 --> 00:53:21.724 - It's listed as 4202 East 10th Street. I just wanted to let you know for the record. I was thinking I 00:53:21.724 --> 00:53:35.390 - was not going to say anything, but I will. I think the commission has said once again, 00:53:35.618 --> 00:53:44.393 - in this position where we cannot do anything. This is a very nice house. It has those right proportions. 00:53:44.393 --> 00:53:53.085 - It's going to use the term cute. I know it's not the proper term, but I think it is. It's a cute house. 00:53:53.085 --> 00:54:01.443 - It has the right proportions, the side, the height. That house is difficult to replicate in today's 00:54:01.443 --> 00:54:03.198 - architectural world. 00:54:04.962 --> 00:54:12.831 - And I say that because it is hard to get things right. And also, I just want to say, you know, Bloomington 00:54:12.831 --> 00:54:20.479 - is going through this crisis of affordability. And again, you just mentioned it, you know, Daniel, like 00:54:20.479 --> 00:54:28.054 - there's a very good chance that it's not going to be affordable for most people. So, I mean, it's this 00:54:28.054 --> 00:54:34.526 - like broken record, but we are in this position where we almost, we cannot do anything. 00:54:35.138 --> 00:54:45.181 - And it's very frustrating. It's very, very frustrating. There's like, yeah, there's not much we can 00:54:45.181 --> 00:54:55.324 - say or do, other than finding some historical data that reinforces our case. But yes, it is a shame. 00:54:55.324 --> 00:55:03.358 - That's it. Thank you. Thank you. I agree. I have no further comments than that. 00:55:04.130 --> 00:55:27.386 - sad to see such a nice example released. But let's move on and call the roll for DD 26-13. Vice Chair 00:55:27.386 --> 00:55:33.086 - Baker? Yes. Commissioner 00:55:33.442 --> 00:55:43.678 - Treasurer Butler? No. Commissioner Castaneda? Yes. Commissioner Duesner? Yes. Commissioner Duffy? Yes. 00:55:43.678 --> 00:55:53.815 - Commissioner Schlegel? Yes. That motion passes 5-1. Motion passed. Thank you all. Let's then move on. 00:55:53.815 --> 00:56:01.566 - I think after. I'm sorry? Yes. I'm sorry. Yes, of course. Today regarding the 00:56:03.042 --> 00:56:09.555 - Today regarding the property located at 403 North Dunn, the Historic Preservation Commission declares 00:56:09.555 --> 00:56:16.196 - that it got notice of proposed demolition and after today's discussion sees no need to review the plans 00:56:16.196 --> 00:56:22.581 - any further and waives the rest of the demolition delay waiting period. The HPC may later recommend 00:56:22.581 --> 00:56:29.030 - the property for historic designation to the common council. Thank you. All right, moving along then 00:56:29.030 --> 00:56:32.414 - to old business. Noah, do you have any old business? 00:56:35.426 --> 00:56:48.043 - Um, there's a few violations that are pretty close to coming up to their time. So, um, apparently one 00:56:48.043 --> 00:57:00.661 - of them, which had received a COA, um, for some retroactive repairs at 1300 East first street, that's 00:57:00.661 --> 00:57:04.990 - supposed to be resolved this week. 00:57:06.818 --> 00:57:16.543 - Then if you remember the apartment building on South Fest, that's going to be coming up next month. 00:57:16.543 --> 00:57:26.268 - So a couple of violations sort of reaching their end point. In terms of other old business, I don't 00:57:26.268 --> 00:57:33.854 - know if anybody from the commission has anything to add. I was just thinking. 00:57:35.906 --> 00:57:45.378 - terms of sending at least a message to city council about how we, and you could probably tell us every 00:57:45.378 --> 00:57:54.666 - month the legality of how this, like if we could set a pattern where one of us says no, just because 00:57:54.666 --> 00:58:04.414 - we can't do that, right? Knowing that you have enough votes to release the delay, but it sets a precedent 00:58:04.546 --> 00:58:12.715 - That's what I'm just trying to do. I set up a precedent that there's been some objection to the case. 00:58:12.715 --> 00:58:21.044 - Now that we all say yes every time because we have our hands tied. I don't know if that means anything. 00:58:21.044 --> 00:58:29.372 - Is this going to be like forever? I just don't understand. You know, we are going to be trapped in this 00:58:29.372 --> 00:58:30.814 - forever and ever. 00:58:31.234 --> 00:58:37.834 - It's my understanding that actually creating the demolition delay was supposed to be the opportunity 00:58:37.834 --> 00:58:44.498 - to stop just the random demolition of things. And so it is a very clunky tool. It's very difficult to 00:58:44.498 --> 00:58:51.098 - meet the standards. But we do want the high standards, right, for what we retain. So I think you can 00:58:51.098 --> 00:58:57.698 - always talk to your council person. You can always talk to your elected officials about your concern 00:58:57.698 --> 00:59:00.638 - that this is not maybe doing what was hoped. 00:59:00.770 --> 00:59:06.948 - in terms of actually preserving. It is giving the opportunity for discussion. And in some instances, 00:59:06.948 --> 00:59:13.126 - as we've seen with Commissioner Butler, some successes in stopping things from being demolished. But 00:59:13.126 --> 00:59:19.488 - the tool itself is very difficult to use successfully. A couple of things that I would bring up to that 00:59:19.488 --> 00:59:26.033 - point as well. At the end of each year, the commission chair is supposed to issue a report to city council 00:59:26.033 --> 00:59:29.214 - about the activities of their board and commission. 00:59:29.794 --> 00:59:38.921 - In the past, I know with Sam, I believe with John Saunders as well, this has been a point they brought 00:59:38.921 --> 00:59:48.136 - up, is their frustration with the demolition delay process. Also, we have a liaison on the city council 00:59:48.136 --> 00:59:56.997 - at Sydney Zulek. So I know that she generally, you know, she's spoken with me and she's spoken with 00:59:56.997 --> 00:59:58.238 - other members 00:59:58.402 --> 01:00:06.726 - of the commission, sorry about some of both our mutual interests and concerns. So I think she should 01:00:06.726 --> 01:00:15.791 - be available for discussion at least. Okay, thank you. I wanted to comment that I was there before demolition 01:00:15.791 --> 01:00:24.362 - delay. I remember it was difficult to get it passed, but it was passed because neighborhoods were being 01:00:24.362 --> 01:00:28.318 - depleted of their housing. So it's interesting. 01:00:28.546 --> 01:00:36.652 - that we put a deliberate layer of administration on, which you don't normally do, you don't normally 01:00:36.652 --> 01:00:44.918 - want to do. But we did it to inhibit just the willy-nilly taking houses and making parking lots in the 01:00:44.918 --> 01:00:53.024 - community. You could take a house down in three days, get it permitted three days and it's gone. One 01:00:53.024 --> 01:00:57.278 - gentleman did that and angered everyone in the city. 01:00:57.858 --> 01:01:06.343 - and demolition delay passed. But now we're in this funny position, funny not ha-ha funny, that where 01:01:06.343 --> 01:01:14.829 - we're giving up good examples of architecture and housing because of demolition delay and we have no 01:01:14.829 --> 01:01:23.230 - path, no good path at the moment that would allow us to designate. And I'm sorry about that. I hope 01:01:23.362 --> 01:01:30.947 - We can change it somehow, but yes, I'll talk to council persons and so on. For whatever good it will 01:01:30.947 --> 01:01:38.533 - do, I hope it does. Keeping the pressure on, keeping influence may one day cause something to break. 01:01:38.533 --> 01:01:46.269 - With that, old business, any more old business that we want to discuss this evening? If not, I'm gonna 01:01:46.269 --> 01:01:50.174 - move on to new business. Anything you know that you 01:01:50.626 --> 01:01:58.325 - I'd like to announce that this is going to be Melody's last meeting with us. I mean, you can tell it 01:01:58.325 --> 01:02:05.948 - sounds like she would like to reapply, but it's going to be leaving on a sabbatical for this coming 01:02:05.948 --> 01:02:13.723 - semester. So it will unfortunately not be with us through the remainder of the year. This has been my 01:02:13.723 --> 01:02:17.534 - first term on historic preservation, and it was a 01:02:17.666 --> 01:02:25.682 - term that had already begun by the time I jumped into it. So it's been a very short term. I have learned 01:02:25.682 --> 01:02:33.393 - so much from all of you. And so thank you all for your patience and helping me understand the rules, 01:02:33.393 --> 01:02:41.180 - what we can do, what we can't do, how to put words to some of these feelings about what is historical 01:02:41.180 --> 01:02:45.150 - and important and what we can actually actively do. 01:02:45.282 --> 01:02:52.792 - Thank you for inspiring me in that direction, and I just really appreciate all your service, and I'm 01:02:52.792 --> 01:03:00.301 - sorry so much to leave you one person down for the fall, because I know that puts pressure on all of 01:03:00.301 --> 01:03:08.406 - you in terms of quorum, and I am really sorry about that. I just want to say I appreciate so much everything 01:03:08.406 --> 01:03:13.982 - that you all put into this, and I really hope to see you again in January. 01:03:15.874 --> 01:03:25.766 - I don't want to use the word enjoyed, but appreciated having you here. And I'd like to ask you, and 01:03:25.766 --> 01:03:35.657 - I hope you will be back. You're the kind of person we need back. Do you have any comments about the 01:03:35.657 --> 01:03:45.054 - commission? Good, bad, indifferent that you have learned being here for the past year or more? 01:03:45.186 --> 01:03:51.824 - Just I think the demolition delay is my least favorite part of the whole process. So that's a tagging 01:03:51.824 --> 01:03:58.396 - on to the previous discussion we were having. I don't like feeling like my hands are tied and I have 01:03:58.396 --> 01:04:05.034 - to vote in favor of these things that I don't want to see disappear. I have been glad to be a part of 01:04:05.034 --> 01:04:12.062 - this because as you all know, I'm a renter and I have not been able to afford to buy a home in Bloomington. 01:04:12.162 --> 01:04:21.070 - And I come to the commission from the perspective of a renter. And so I would say, I think having seen 01:04:21.070 --> 01:04:29.718 - the commission's work from the inside, I can see how it does a lot to help maintain, help encourage 01:04:29.718 --> 01:04:31.102 - things that are 01:04:31.618 --> 01:04:40.279 - at least more affordable rents, smaller houses, the kind of housing stock that somebody like me depends 01:04:40.279 --> 01:04:48.857 - on. As a renter and a non-driver, I need to be able to walk to town, need to be able to afford to live 01:04:48.857 --> 01:04:57.517 - here. And I appreciate the fact that historic preservation does a lot to support that kind of community 01:04:57.517 --> 01:05:01.598 - and that kind of architecture. I think that I've 01:05:01.730 --> 01:05:09.400 - I really appreciate the packets that are put together that makes preparation for the meetings really 01:05:09.400 --> 01:05:17.146 - easy. And it makes that not a super time consuming process, which I've told other people who might be 01:05:17.146 --> 01:05:24.891 - interested in joining the commission. Here's kind of what the preparation looks like. But yeah, those 01:05:24.891 --> 01:05:31.422 - are generally my comments. And I just appreciate everybody's time and effort on this. 01:05:31.682 --> 01:05:40.628 - I know none of us are doing this except for Noah. None of us are doing this full time. So, yeah. 01:05:40.628 --> 01:05:50.220 - Thank you. All right. Let's hear if we have any public comment online. There was one comment from Sabre 01:05:50.220 --> 01:05:56.030 - Buyers just that she mentioned. If I can read that. Certainly. 01:05:56.226 --> 01:06:03.308 - It was she had mentioned that she was backtracking and adding a comment about 216 North Lincoln Street 01:06:03.308 --> 01:06:10.321 - that the owner would be happy to donate the limestone flower boxes. However, the demolition delay was 01:06:10.321 --> 01:06:17.197 - applied for due to a major fire in that location. So the condition of the box is unknown. I let her 01:06:17.197 --> 01:06:24.141 - know that I would pass that information along and read it during the comment period. Yeah, they were 01:06:24.141 --> 01:06:25.310 - there yesterday. 01:06:25.474 --> 01:06:33.497 - Again, I just said I would read the comment that was typed in here. I mean, not that it's necessarily 01:06:33.497 --> 01:06:41.363 - germane one way or another, but I did see interior pics from the fire. You did what? I did see some 01:06:41.363 --> 01:06:49.229 - interior pics from the fire. Oh. And yeah, the exterior appearance really sort of belies the damage 01:06:49.229 --> 01:06:52.926 - inside. All right. With that, we're adjourned.