- We'll call to order the meeting of the Ellsville Board of Zoning Appeals for November 12th, 2025. Travis,
- would you list in the Pledge of Allegiance? I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of
- America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and
- justice for all.
- Thank you. We're in a roll call, please. Here. Here. Pat was the law scheme here. Caleb plumber here.
- Okay, first time on our agenda is the approval of the minutes for our meeting on August 13th, 2025.
- Second. We have a motion to second all those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed. Motion carries.
- Does anyone have a conflict of interest statement they need to make on the items on our agenda for tonight?
- We have approval of the meeting dates for 2026. You have a list of our meeting dates for 2026 on here. Correct.
- So you'll find a few of them are out of sequence, and that's because sometimes we had to change plan
- commission date, and I didn't want the BZA and plan commission the same week. Okay. So I want to make
- a motion to approve these. I make a motion to approve the 2026 Board of Zoning Appeals meeting dates.
- I'll second that. We have a motion and second. All those in favor say aye.
- Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. We have no old business. The first item on our new business agenda is
- a petition for a variance from development standards to reduce the east side yard setback to six feet
- for 4567 West Johanna Drive lot six in the Arvin subdivision. The petitioner is Todd Sextator, case
- number BZA 25-10.
- Good evening. First on the agenda this evening is petitioner Todd Sackstetter is requesting a variance
- from development standards to reduce the east side setback of 4567 West Johanna Drive from 10 feet to
- six feet. Petitioner's request for development standard variance is the only item to be considered by
- the board of zoning appeals. The property is zoned R1, single family residential.
- Property owner 5475 East Union Valley Road to the east does not object to the reduction of the side
- yard setback. Petitioner's Engineer Smith Design Group Incorporated has provided a plot plan which shows
- the layout of the house on the parcel and is attached to the staff report. In taking action on all variances
- of board zoning appeals shall be used the following decision criteria
- consistent with the requirements of Indiana code. The approval of the variances from development standards
- will not be interest to the public health safety morals and general welfare of the community. The approval
- would not cause any significant problems in relation to public health and safety. The use or value of
- the area adjacent to the property included in the variance will not be affected in a substantially adverse manner.
- The development standard variance will not affect adjacent properties in a substantially adverse manner.
- The adjacent neighbor agrees with the development standard variance. The strict application of the terms
- of the zoning ordinance will result in practical difficulties in the use of the property. Approval of
- variance from development standards will permit a homeowner to set the house independent from the standards
- required by the developer. Compliance with comprehensive plan
- The variance request is substantially in compliance with the existing comprehensive plan. The variance
- from development standards is in compliance with residential land use and the comprehensive plan. The
- need for the variance does not arise from some condition peculiar to the property involved, while the
- current status of the development does not result in a financial hardship for the petitioner
- It will do so if the variance is not approved as it will limit how the house can be constructed on the
- lot. The variance request is substantially in compliance with other town codes. The property is currently
- in compliance with all other town codes. The purpose of the variance is to provide relief in situations
- where the land or other condition officer offers resistance to meeting a particular zoning regulation
- through no fault of the occupant of the land.
- Therefore, based on the above analysis, it is staff opinion that the variances meet all requirements
- and therefore recommends approval of the variance request. The board may approve the variance if after
- testimony and discussion, it finds that the request meets all six of the stated requirements. If the
- board denies the variance, it shall state which requirement has not been met and petitioners present
- if you have any questions.
- So basically from what I see here is just the right rear corner of the house is going to encroach into
- the setback a little bit due to the fact that the lot is shaped at an angle, but the house has to be
- parallel to the road. That's correct. When developer value built construction laid out the lots, it
- was just to be a straightforward house.
- I think it's suit that lot better to have a little angle to it. And the property owners to the right
- I see have a letter in here saying that they don't oppose this. Correct. Anybody have any questions
- for Denise? Not me. No, I do not. Okay. Would the petitioner like to say something? If you have any
- questions, just I've got my
- people that I'm looking to build the house for, Hannah and John, contacts that are, and the reason being
- for it is we went through, talked to the neighbors, the door hangs, and they're excited about it because
- they want somebody, obviously they want somebody that they want as their neighbor. These people live
- in the neighborhood now, they want a bigger house, they have family in the neighborhood. These lots
- came available and I have access to them and they came to me and approached me about building
- I've got a couple of the lots that I'm going to build in there. And so I said, yeah, let's try to do
- this. It makes sense because they have a grown family. They want a little bigger house. And it's not
- a real wide house. And it's just what can really fit on there. And in order to tweak it just a little
- bit to get them square to the road, they're coming to their house every day. This is their house they
- want to live in for potentially ever. They want to be in this neighborhood.
- I think it fits all the protocol or the requirements and especially you've got people from Ellitsville
- and stay in Ellitsville and even in that neighborhood. Does anybody have any questions from the petitioner?
- No. Is there anybody from the public that wants to comment on this? I mean for me, I mean it's a pretty simple
- Pretty simple thing, it's not complicated, it's not gonna bother anybody. I will make a motion that
- we approve case number BZA 25-10. I'll second. Motion and a second, roll call please. David Dre. Yes.
- Travis Conyer. Yes. Pat Wesolowski. Yes. Caleb Plummer. Yes. Okay, thank you. Thank you very much.
- Excuse me for a minute, I'm trying to see, once I add somebody to the Zoom, it cut me out from sharing,
- so I'm trying to see if I can change that.
- I don't know what else to do, so. We have some security settings now. Okay. I'll try. Yeah, it worked.
- All right, we're back in business. The next item on our agenda is petition for a special exception to
- allow storage units and an industrial one zoning district and two variances from development standards
- to reduce the minimum buffer yard width to 15 feet for the south and west property lines and to remove
- the buffer yard requirements for the east property line at 8631 West Flatwoods Road. The petitioner
- is Steve Grow.
- This is case number BZA 25-12. Thank you. Second on the agenda, Petitioner Steve Grove is requesting
- special exception to allow storage units at 8631 West Flatwoods Road, Gosport, and is zoned Industrial
- 1. He's also requesting two variances to reduce the required buffer yard width to a minimum of 15 feet
- along the south and west property lines and to remove the buffer yard requirement
- along the east property line. Subject parcels currently zone commercial two. The plan commission at
- its November 6, 2025 meeting voted unanimously to forward a favorable recommendation to town council
- to rezone the property to industrial one. Town council will vote on the zoning map amendment at its
- November 24th meeting. On November 11th, petitioner's representatives submitted an updated project narrative
- which also includes findings
- I want to note they are the engineer's draft of findings, not the findings for the Board of Zoning Appeals.
- Petitioner also submitted project narrative on October 20th and it was included in your packet sent
- to you on November 7th. Petitioner provided a proposed plan for the cell storage which was submitted
- today at 312 p.m. I've only had time to glance at it, so it's up to you if you want to consider it in
- your decision.
- For the special exception, under the unified development ordinance, storage units are permitted by special
- exception with additional standards in industrial one and industrial two zoning districts. Staff would
- note that the petitioners started this self-storage project prior to the moratorium on self-storage
- buildings being issued. The moratorium was in effect until the UDO was approved. The UDO changed the
- zoning districts
- for self-storage units to I-1 and I-2 with special exception prior to the approval of the UDO. The adjacent
- property to the west of subject parcel is zoned commercial to and has storage units on it. The petitioner
- owns the property to the east and the property to the south was approved for storage units some time
- ago. The Ellsville comprehensive plan designates land to be general business with primary uses that
- include large-scale businesses.
- such as light industries, warehousing, and distribution centers, which incorporate an array of modern,
- low-impact industrial uses that include warehousing, distribution, and wholesale facilities. Variance
- from development standards, request number one. Petitioners seeking a variance from development standards
- to reduce the minimum buffer yard width to 15 feet along the south and west property lines. Adjacent
- properties are zoned commercial two.
- The UDO Table 4.5 requires a minimum buffer yard width of 60 feet between zoning districts. The adjacent
- property to west has storage units and the parcel to the south is approved for storage units some time
- ago as I stated earlier. Variance from development standards request number two. Petitioners requesting
- a variance from development standards to remove the 60 foot
- Buffer between the I-1 and C-2 zoning districts along the east property line. The property at 8325 West
- State Road 46 is owned by the petitioner. The Town of Ellitsville and stormwater standards and specifications
- manual requires a retention pond to capture the runoff from 8325 West State Road 46
- onto the subject parcel requiring a 60-foot buffer would prevent the construction of the retention pond.
- In addition, the development plan for the storage units will also result in improvements for 8325 West
- State Road 46 at the request of the Planning Department. In taking action on all variance requests,
- the Board of Zoning and Appeals shall use the following decision criteria consistent with the requirements
- of Indiana Code.
- The approval of the variances from development standards will not be injurious to the public health
- safety morals and general welfare of the community. Approval would not cause any significant problems
- in relation to public health and safety. The use or value of the area adjacent to the property included
- in the variance will not be affected in a substantially adverse manner. The development standard variances
- will not affect adjacent properties in a substantially adverse manner.
- The variances will allow a use that agrees with adjacent properties and the petitioner owns the property
- to the east. The strict application of the terms of the zoning ordinance will result in a practical
- difficulties in the use of the property. The strict application of UDO 4.5 required buffer yard width
- and buffer yard plantings would place restrictions on a parcel that would make it prohibitive.
- to construct a project that so clearly aligns with the comprehensive plan and adjacent properties. The
- variance request is substantially in compliance with the existing comprehensive plan. The proposed use
- of storage units is no longer allowed in commercial zoning districts. However, self-storage units line
- with the Ellsville comprehensive plan, the area west Ellsville,
- It is designated as general business with primary uses that include large-scale businesses such as light
- industries, warehousing, and distribution centers which incorporate an array of modern low-impact industrial
- uses that include warehousing, distribution, and wholesale facilities as stated earlier. The need for
- the variance
- does arise from some condition peculiar to the property involved. The current requirements of the UDO
- would reduce the buildable footprint, making it economically infeasible to construct. The variance request
- is substantially in compliance with other town codes. The property is currently in compliance with all
- other town codes. The Board of Zoning Appeals action shall be in a form of approval, approval
- with conditions, denial, or continuance.
- The Board of Zoning Appeals takes final actions on all variance petitions. The purpose of a variance
- is to provide relief in situations where land or other condition offers resistance to meeting a particular
- zoning regulations through no fault of the occupant of the land. Therefore, based on the above analysis,
- it is of staff opinion that the special exception to allow storage units be approved and the condition
- with the condition that the rezoning of the parcel to industrial one is approved by town council. It
- is also staff opinion that the variances meet all requirements and therefore recommends approval of
- the variance request. The board may approve the variances if after testimony and discussion, it finds
- that the request meet all six requirements stated above and if the board denies the variance, it shall
- state which requirement has not been
- Um, proven and petitioners representative is here if you have any questions. And updated to your packet
- has mentioned is the new narrative and then the plan showing the storage units. But I don't have those
- on overhead. So have we heard anything from the property owners to the West or the South about this?
- No. And I don't.
- Are there, I kinda got lost here. They're wanting a variance to the west as well as to the south? No,
- well the variance affects the property lines for the buffer yard. The buffer yard's what I meant, yeah.
- So, well, we haven't heard anything from.
- Either one of those. So on the south and west, he wants to reduce it to 15 feet and that's so they can
- still get some plantings in. And then to the east, they want to remove that 60 foot requirement between
- zoning districts and he owns the property to the east. I'm concerned about to the east. I was just trying
- to figure out
- if there would be any issues with the properties to the south or the west. I mean, it's all basically
- commercial, so. Correct. It's not like it's somebody's backyard. Did they talk to him about reducing
- one of the buildings? Would that help him out? Well, we aren't here to discuss that. That's just a proposal,
- a glance at it, but he will have to come back to plan commission for development plan approval.
- The UDO now requires meetings before applications are filed, so I'm sure it will be a discussion. But
- as you noted, when this started, we didn't require, when this project was first considered, we didn't
- require some of those setbacks. Correct. So it wouldn't have had to come to the BCA if
- it had actually started sooner. Correct. And then we placed a moratorium until the UDO was approved.
- OK. Does anybody have any more questions for Denise? I do not. OK. Would the petitioner like to say
- anything? You really get around, don't you? I do.
- My name is A.J. Willis, Fine and Fanion Associates. So I've been working with the petitioner on this
- project since 2023. The property was originally zoned C3, and the adjacent properties to the southeast
- and west were also C3. When the new UDO came out, all C3 zoning got switched to C2.
- As Denise mentioned, the self-storage is no longer allowed in the C2 zoning district. So I've been working
- with Denise to kind of get everything finalized and one of the things we had to do was rezone the parcel
- to light industrial to allow the self-storage with the special exception. And the reason we are going
- for the buffer yard variances and it's actually
- we only want to request a 20 foot minimum instead of 15. We just want it to be to kind of match the
- C2 zoning. So in the UDO between the C2 zoning districts, you are only required to 20 foot buffery yard
- instead of a 60 foot between light industrial and C2. So since all the adjacent properties are similar
- uses, we feel that the 60 foot buffer yard
- Is a little excessive since you know each each property is the same intensity of use and the buffer
- yards really supposed to buffer the higher intensity uses compared to low intensity uses The adjacent
- property to the west is self storage South they have some outdoor storage and then to the east is waste
- transfer facility and the properties to the east and west are really only allowed in the
- industrial zoning district, but they're existing businesses, so we can't rezone those properties. Let
- me see here. Yeah, so we just wanna request the buffery yard variance to reduce it down to what would
- be if it was between a C2 and a C2 zoning district since the adjacent and the subject property are similar uses.
- And do you have any questions for me? And then also that preliminary drawing is still just a preliminary
- plan. It's subject to change. A lot of that depends on the new bioretention requirements. We've had
- to increase our pond size on the west property line. It's about three times larger now, so we've shifted
- everything. So that layout is subject to change.
- So have you had any contact with the property owners to the west or the south? I have not. I believe
- the petitioner has talked to the property owner to the south and then the property owner to the west.
- We were recently trying to get in contact with them, but I believe the ownership changed maybe a month
- or two ago and we don't know who to contact for that.
- But basically, you have to come to the BZA because the town kind of changed the rules mid process. And
- also the stormwater, we have a new stormwater manual that was updated and approved earlier this year.
- And when he started, it was based on the old stormwater code. Does anybody have any questions for the
- petitioner? Well, would this show where the retention fund will be at? It's not shown on there,
- but it's long.
- the west property line. So right at the end of the buildings on the west side, there's a drive aisle
- on the west side of the buildings, and then the bioretention will be immediately adjacent to that. There
- will also be a small bioretention pond in between the existing parking of Ava's parking lot and the
- new development. So it's kind of a two tiered system. Well, the existing parking lot's right there on
- 46. The way I look at it now, for Ava,
- They look at the vehicle that the employees vehicles or his vehicles. It's a vehicle storage for the
- trucks behind the building. And that's what they are modifying when they bring the development plan
- for the storage units. I asked that they change their parking so they have more parking. I don't want
- to put the
- cart in front of the horse, that's my concern. But maybe other people's concerns are different. Well,
- the development plan will come before the planning commission and it has to go through tech review as
- well. Okay, any more questions for the petitioner? Seeing none, thank you. Is there anyone from the
- public that wants to speak on this?
- Seeing none, I will make a motion that we approve the special exception and the two development standard
- variances for case number BZA 25-12. I'll second. Okay, roll call please. Yes.
- Yeah. Yes. Sorry. Thank you. Okay. Motion carries. Okay. The next item on our agenda is a petition for
- a use variance to allow an electronic variable message sign in the downtown district.
- and a variance from development standards to allow an electronic variable message sign less than the
- required 150 feet from a signalized intersection. This is located at 109 North Sale Street. The petitioner
- is Joel Deutsch. Deutsch? Case number BZA 25-11. Thank you.
- This petition is a request by Joel Deutsch for consideration of a use variance to allow a variable message
- sign in downtown district and a variance from development standards to allow a variable message sign
- 135 feet from an intersection. Subject partial is located at 109 North Sale Street. The unified development
- ordinance does not allow electronic variable message signs in a downtown district.
- Electronic variable message signs are only permitted in commercial two, industrial one, and industrial
- two zoning districts. The intent of a downtown district is to enhance and protect the character of the
- existing downtown area and to guide new development and redevelopment activities that are compatible
- with existing character.
- The intent of the UDO sign standards 4.9A is to encourage signs to be compatible with the surrounding
- area, to maintain and enhance the aesthetic environment of the community, and most importantly, to eliminate
- potential hazards to motorists and pedestrians resulting from sign clutter and to promote the health,
- safety, and welfare of the citizens.
- The use variance request is contrary to the Ellsville comprehensive plan, which designates downtown,
- and the surrounding resident core has central Ellsville. This is an area that is oldest and the most
- identifiable area in Ellsville. The area is home to many historic commercial and residential structures
- that add to the character of central Ellsville. Staff does not support the petitioner's request for
- a use variance for the following reasons.
- Safety concerns, changing messages, animations, or shifts in brightness can distract drivers and pedestrians,
- especially when the sun goes down. At a recent supervisors meeting, the administrator asked the supervisors,
- police, fire, DPW, and planning and the town manager for their opinion of the proposed electronic variable
- message sign.
- All at the meeting agreed that the electronic variable message sign was not only a safety issue because
- of the distraction for drivers, but it would take away from the charm of the downtown district in central
- Evansville. More specifically, the supervisors and town manager asked the administrator to convey their
- concerns and requests to the Board of Zoning Appeals and ask that this petition not be granted. Digital
- signs conflict
- With historic aesthetics, several properties in the downtown district have national places of historic
- places designation. Light pollution and electronic signs emit continuous or flashing light that disrupts
- the traditional nighttime character of downtown. In addition, light spill can negatively affect residents,
- pedestrians, and nearby businesses creating glare and discomfort. In addition, the rendering under the
- electronic
- variable message sign exceeding the maximum size for a wall sign which is 50 square feet pursuant to
- the UDO Table 4.13. It measures approximately 216 square feet. Variance from development standards.
- Petitioners seeking a variance from development standards to reduce the minimum distance for having
- electronic variable message sign at the intersection
- to 135 feet, UDO section 4.9 F2, electronic variable message sign requires no sign containing an EVMS,
- which is electronic variable message signs, has a component, shall be located within 150 feet of any
- signalized intersection and 500 feet from any property line of a parcel with residential use, residential
- structure or residential zoning district.
- Staff does not support the petitioner's request for a variance from development standards for basically
- the same reasons listed under request for use variance. In taking action, all variance requests the
- board's own appeal shall use the following design decision criteria consistent with the requirements
- of the Indiana code. General welfare, the approval of variance from development standards will be injurious
- to the public health, safety, morals, and general welfare of the community.
- Approval would result in light pollution, driver distraction, and conflict with historic aesthetics
- of the downtown district. The use or value of the area adjacent to property included in the variance
- will be affected in a substantially adverse manner. The development standard variance will affect adjacent
- properties in a substantially adverse manner with the light moving message from the sign. The strict
- application of the terms of the zoning ordinance will not result in practical difficulties in the use
- of the property.
- petitioners seeking a use variance for an electronic variable message sign that is not permitted in
- the downtown district. Therefore, the terms of the zoning ordinance are clear and that is not permitted
- and therefore does not result in a practical difficulty. The variance request is not substantially in
- compliance with the existing comprehensive plan.
- The request for the variance from development standards is contrary to the Ellsville Comprehensive Plan,
- which designates downtown and the surrounding residential core of central Ellsville. As stated before,
- this is an area that is the oldest and most identifiable area of Ellsville. The area is home to many
- historic commercial and residential structures that add character to central Ellsville. The need for
- a variance does not arise from some condition peculiar to the property involved.
- The property does not have a peculiar condition. It requires development standards variance for electronical
- variable message sign. The variance request is substantially in compliance with other town codes. The
- property is currently in compliance with all other town codes. I will note today before our 11 a.m.
- cutoff, I received calls from two community organizations who wish to remain anonymous.
- asking me to convey their disagreement with the proposed signage and intrusion the sign will bring to
- the downtown district to the Board of Zoning Appeals. The Board of Zoning Appeals action shall be in
- a form of approval, approval with conditions, denial or continuance. The Board of Zoning Appeals takes
- final action on all variance petitions.
- The purpose of a variance is to provide relief in situations where land or other condition offers resistance
- to meeting a particular zoning regulation through no fault of the occupant of the land, and this is
- not the case with this petition. Therefore, based on the above analysis and criteria, it is a staff
- opinion that the request
- for the UCL ordinance to allow electronic variable message sign in the downtown district should be denied.
- Staff also request the rendering below the electronic variable message sign be denied as it exceeds
- the maximum allowable square footage for wall signs. It is also a staff opinion that the variance from
- development standards to allow
- An electronic variable message signed 135 feet from an intersection should be denied. The board may
- approve the variances if after testimony and discussion, it finds that the requests of all six criteria
- have been met. If the board denies a variance, it shall state which requirements have not been met.
- And I believe I answered those. So petitioners present, if you have any questions.
- And I'll scan through. So this is a photo of the proposed sign at the top and painting or I don't know
- if that's painting or sign at the bottom and took some pictures of the intersection in case you didn't
- know where the building was and the parking lot in front the library parking lot to give you an idea
- of where it's located.
- And that's just looking across temperance at the building. And that's at temperance. That's just another
- direction of the intersection with the building to the right. And that's the aerial of where the building's
- located. I have one problem. When people call in right and they say they're anonymous,
- You know, I can't take that. If I got something to say, I'm going to say it to them. Why would you write
- and didn't want something to go on? Why don't you say who you are? Well, you'd be surprised in code
- enforcement how many anonymous complaints we receive. And I don't know if they fear retaliation or what.
- Yeah, I just don't.
- I can't accept that. I mean, I'm sorry. I mean, I just pushed that to the side. Now, the question I
- have is, is that there's been a form sent out to the surrounding businesses, am I correct, or surrounding
- people? Yeah, so we go two parcels past all the way around. OK, did anybody reject on that?
- I got a call from somebody downtown not wanting it, and they were going to try to come to the meeting.
- But to be honest, I don't remember the name. That's been two weeks ago. OK, does anybody else have any
- questions for Denise from the board? What's the sign supposed to be used for?
- Petitioner told me it's going to be conveying messages. And I think people can either subscribe or pay
- him to put their message board up there, put their message up there. So it'll be a lighted scrolling
- message. Or maybe it'll put a message up and stay. I don't know. When these signs are developed, do
- they come with specific luminosity?
- standards or? The town has requirements for the standards it wants so it would have to be designed in
- accordance with our standards. Yeah and then in terms of changing since it's electronic and then it's
- just going to be shifting all the time because it does seem like it would be a distraction so that safety
- concern there with the luminosity. Yeah and it's down a
- across the parking lot, so people would have to turn their heads to look at it. It's not like it would
- be ahead, you know, straight ahead. Right. Okay, any more questions from the minutes? This side would
- be towards the 46th, would it be? It's on, it would face 46th. It would face 46th. Mm-hmm, Temperance Street.
- So it's the end of the building, the library parking lot, and then 46. Okay, let's hear from the petitioner.
- Come on up and tell us your name again and sign in.
- First thing I want to clear up is it's only 50 square foot, which is what I was told that was the size
- that the actual screen of the electronic part can be. Well, I was talking about the lower part. I don't
- know if this is a sign or a mural, but it exceeds the 50. It was going to be a mural, obviously, trying
- to add more art to, in fact, Sale Street, which I've already been doing. I also own the building next
- door of Oddfellows, which I've restored into a beautiful
- for Sale Street. One of the objectives for the sign is to help actually bring business to Sale Street,
- which is my main motive, is I'm really trying to develop and make Sale Street into a place that people
- are going to be coming into. With that, the caffeinated, the in-store, all of that would be places that
- I would like to help bring more people to and have Sale Street be more of a shopping area that people
- want to stop at.
- I wrote a little thing. Good evening. I'm Joel Deutsch, owner of Roseview Terrace at 109 North Sale
- Street. Thank you for the opportunity to share my proposal for a small, well-managed digital sign designed
- to help bring attention, business, and communication to downtown Ellersville. The goal is to energize
- Sale Street and support local businesses, events, and community identity. The display would highlight
- local promotions, town activities, and community messages in a modern and visually engaging way.
- It's about strengthening visibility and helping people know what's happening in Ellisville. Community
- benefit is a tool to stimulate foot traffic, support local comrades, can display seasonal messages,
- nonprofit activities, and civic information, adds a contemporary element that aligns with broader
- revitalization efforts, professionally installed designed to complement the building facade and surrounding
- properties,
- operated with appropriate brightness and timing consistent with downtown character, managed responsibly
- with content focused on local relevance and community spirit. The project is about helping Ellitsville
- thrive by giving Sale Street an attractive, modern, and useful communication tool that supports local
- businesses and community connection. That's my intention of why I wanted to bring this. I own the apartment
- building as well.
- and just trying to help bring more activity onto Sale Street, which I thought that's what the revitalization
- of Sale Street was all about. Okay, does anybody have any questions for the petitioner? As you talked
- in, you commit to revitalization, have you talked to that committee at all?
- I'm not sure what committee that you referred to. I didn't realize I was going to have so much objectiveness
- to this process. Are you talking about the redevelopment commission? Yeah. No, he hasn't. No, no. I
- was going to say, it would probably be advisable to talk to them. No, but I have spoken to caffeinated
- cook as well as in-store. They were very excited. My newest tenant, which is Romance Knitting or Knitting
- Romance, as well as the next door, which I'm putting in the same building, are all very excited to be
- able to have
- an added venue and being able to get people to sale street. You own the building that were rich and
- big philosophies, RBB used to be? Yes. Yes, correct. Putting that- Which has been a major revitalization.
- Putting that- Debt. Steps and everything on it. Yes, sir. Oh, yeah. I mean, if you saw the befores and
- afters of that building, it's been quite a project. Not bad.
- And a beautiful project, I'm very proud of it. Very proud to be able to offer that to the town
- of Ellitsville. Okay, anybody else have any questions? No, I do not. Further petitions? Questions right
- now. Okay, I think we'll hear from the public now. Okay, thank you. All two of them.
- Does anyone out there want to address us on this issue? Okay, seeing none. Okay, now how about comments?
- I'd like to, I mean, I'd like to, if anybody else would like to comment first, I'd like to go after
- them. Can I add one other thing? Okay, real quick. Just that there was a lot of other digital signs on 46.
- Two of them in particular, People's Bank is within an intersection that's a lot less than 145 feet that
- we're speaking of. Domino's also is very close to an intersection. All have digital signs. And there's
- a few other digital signs on Sale Street that are also familiar to other businesses. And those were
- probably all grandfathered before the... That's correct. So, I wanted to say something, but I have to
- wait on you to finish, or if I say something, go ahead.
- I just want to remind you the character of downtown. And I also wanted to state the town is currently
- going through a branding phase that will address signage in the different areas of town. So that's all
- I wanted to say. You know, I understand what you're saying, but that sign is not going to be downtown.
- It's in the downtown district. I understand that, but it's not
- facing the main street in downtown. It has the lighting, the visual aspect of it's gonna come off of
- 46, not come off of coming out of the cafe and looking up. I know that we're concerned about driver
- distraction on 46 and the safety features and
- the fire chief and police chief or among the group to specifically ask you not to approve it? I'm not
- that concerned, to be honest with you, because you go to any town and you see them. And I don't see
- any major deterrence because of accidents. I haven't heard of any. That doesn't mean they don't happen.
- And it doesn't mean it does happen. But I'm looking at it is that
- That sign is not, I know it's in a downtown district, but it's not downtown. It's facing, it's facing
- Big Bees Coffee and the new pink building, okay? They're facing the library per se, but it's not facing
- any apartments downtown. It's not facing any businesses downtown.
- I'm not saying that it's, I don't want to say it, to say, yeah, well, let's okay it or not. I'm just
- giving my thoughts on it. If he was in the front of the building, then I'd say it's downtown,
- but it's not. I just have to disagree on that. You'd go down the other end and look at a store that's
- got a lot of sign in it.
- I saw it just after this evening when I came in. Now that one's in, right in town. That's my thoughts.
- You know, I mean, it's, the historic part of it, you know, it kind of, I see both sides of it.
- on everything, it's hard for me. The positioning and stuff, he makes a valid point, but just the historic
- stuff and then the signage and everything. I mean, I would say there would definitely have to be stipulations
- if so, but there is a lot of,
- walking traffic that goes through there, too, that we have to take into consideration,
- you know, distractions. I mean, it's all valid, valid points. So I would like to hear from more people
- before I can make up my decision. Well, I guess I would say again that the I know for a long time we
- didn't allow electronic signs at all.
- and then we kind of got some, but they're all grandfathered in. I don't know that it's a trend that
- we especially want to start right there in that particular area. We do appreciate all of the remodeling
- and interest that you've shown in Ellitsville, but with all of this opposition,
- I just don't think it's a good time for us to ignore the recommendation of our planning department and
- our other department heads and start this trend right now, maybe after some other groups have had time
- to think about it and weigh in on it.
- I might have a different opinion, but I think that right now is not the time to overrule the planning
- department based on all of the findings that were made by the planning department for the criteria.
- I thought we had one person on there, but I guess they left. I was looking to see
- if there was anything in chat before you made your decisions. It looks like they left. It's not that
- we can't overrule the planning department's recommendations, but I need a good reason to do that. And
- I'm not able to come up with one right at the moment. Yeah, I think personally with
- I'm not sure exactly what the full picture is on the development plan for the future. I personally like
- more of. More of an I don't want to say old fashioned, but I guess I I don't really personally go for
- contemporary things, especially if it seems to me like it's more of a safety. Issue there with
- the distractions and so.
- That's kind of where I'm at with it. Okay, would someone like to make a motion? We'll make a motion
- that we deny the request. Based on the criteria provided by the planning department. So one through
- five. You'll need two motions.
- for the use variance and the variances from development standards. Okay, was that a motion for the use
- variance? That's your downtown district. Okay, I'll second it. Roll call please. David Drake. Yes, is a.
- No, for the development, is that correct? Yes or no? Correct, his motion was to deny it. So your yes
- is to agree with his motion. Travis Conyer? Yes. Pat Wesolowski? No. Caleb Plummer? Yes. Thank you,
- and then the variants from development.
- Are you making a motion to not approve the variance from the development standards? Yes. And I'll second
- that one. Roll call, please. David Drake? Yes. Travis Conyer? Yes. Pat Wesolowski? No. Caleb Plummer?
- Yes. Thank you.
- Maybe keep working on it. You have to appeal to the trial court. And I think that's 30 days from their
- decision. Next meeting is December.
- and I believe I'll have new business. Anybody want to say anything? Not an agenda item? Good evening,
- I didn't know the process of making an appeal, but I was told you guys were the ones that I needed to
- come see about
- some fines that I received into it. Excuse me. Yeah. So you go ahead. Yeah, I'd like to state from the
- record that Mr. Barrett did contact me this morning concerning his protocol for the appeals process
- and to which I responded that I was not sure. So as I understood that would be an agenda item that you
- would need to get on the agenda, this is just like general
- comments about anything in general, but an appeal would be an agenda item you would need to get so that
- we can notify other people and do the process the way it has to be done. And I will say his time has
- passed to appeal to the BZA. My decision to find him was issued on May 2nd of this year. So his 30 days
- have passed.
- I don't know what this is about, but. Well, I'd be glad to explain it. Sometimes there's somebody that
- wants to listen because that's what this is all about is communication and understanding and lack of
- communication. But I don't know who to take it to. This is what I was told to do. I'm just a business
- owner downtown and trying to run a business, grow downtown and just an obstacle of finding a business that's
- small business and what was told to me is I needed to take it here. There wasn't a timeline given. I'm
- sure there's something in writing somewhere that I was supposed to uncover myself, but. So if you missed
- the deadline, would the next step be small claims court? Trial court. Trial court. You would have, since
- you missed the deadline. Well, this is what will happen is I won't pay the fine and I'll just go without building.
- the building that I was going to, and then we'll keep this exasperated process of small businesses not
- being able to grow because of bureaucracy. So I've come, this is what I was told to do by Mike, by Denise,
- everybody I've communicated with Mike after this 30 days, he said this is the process, I'm here, I apologize
- for not following it. Is my ignorance, then that's okay, I'll take it, but it's one more step and the
- challenge is to add a building onto my building
- It's not even what this is about, it was about remodeling my building, but I will look into the process
- of taking this to court, I guess. Okay, all right, thank you. Planning Commission comments, BZA comments.
- Oh, I cut and pasted the agenda format. Then an adjourn.