WEBVTT 00:00:00.642 --> 00:00:09.646 - Okay, we'll call to order the meeting of the Ellsville Plan Commission for September 3rd, 2026. Steve, 00:00:09.646 --> 00:00:18.389 - would you lead us in our Pledge of Allegiance? I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States 00:00:18.389 --> 00:00:27.218 - of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty 00:00:27.218 --> 00:00:29.054 - and justice for all. 00:00:32.098 --> 00:00:42.037 - Roll call, please. David Drake. Here. Dan Swafford. Steve Hale. Here. Zach Merkle. Here. Pamela Samples. 00:00:42.037 --> 00:00:51.786 - Ryan Skaggs. Pat Resnick. Here. Okay, the first item on our agenda is approval of the minutes from our 00:00:51.786 --> 00:01:01.630 - meeting on July 9th, 2026. So moved. Second. We have a motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. 00:01:01.794 --> 00:01:11.045 - Aye. Opposed? Hearing none, motion carries. We have no old business. We have one item of new business, 00:01:11.045 --> 00:01:20.206 - primary plat approval for four lots consisting of 3.99 acres in the Blackwell subdivision at 3750 and 00:01:20.206 --> 00:01:29.726 - 3820 West State Road Fit 46. Petitioner is Kenny Blackwell of Blackwell Contractors. Case number PC26-25. 00:01:32.002 --> 00:01:52.419 - Subject parcels are located at 3750 and 3820 West State Road 46. The lots are zoned commercial 2, which 00:01:52.419 --> 00:01:56.542 - is general business. 00:01:57.186 --> 00:02:04.641 - Subdivision is accessed from West State Road 46. Individual lots will be accessed by a private drive. 00:02:04.641 --> 00:02:12.315 - The lots will meet all size and dimensional requirements of the unified development ordinance. Technical 00:02:12.315 --> 00:02:19.697 - review committee met on August 19th, 2026, and all items have been addressed. I would note, however, 00:02:19.697 --> 00:02:26.494 - that after petitioners engineer made revisions to incorporate the technical review comments, 00:02:27.330 --> 00:02:34.081 - The fire department advised that the drive serving lots one and two are required to be located 50 feet 00:02:34.081 --> 00:02:40.832 - from the center line of the main drive. Due to the timing of the review, there was not sufficient time 00:02:40.832 --> 00:02:46.206 - to incorporate this revision into the plans prior to the plan commission meeting. 00:02:47.106 --> 00:02:54.477 - Staff will request conditional approval if the plans be revised to demonstrate compliance with the fire 00:02:54.477 --> 00:03:01.635 - department's 50 foot access requirements for lots one and two. Petitioners engineer agrees with this 00:03:01.635 --> 00:03:08.794 - conditional approval. The plan commission action on the primary plat can be in the form of approval, 00:03:08.794 --> 00:03:16.023 - approval with conditions, denial or to continue the hearing. The plan commission has the final say in 00:03:16.023 --> 00:03:17.086 - these matters. 00:03:17.826 --> 00:03:24.711 - It is the staff opinion that the proposed primary plat will meet all required zoning and subdivision 00:03:24.711 --> 00:03:32.141 - regulations. Therefore, staff recommends that the plan commission approve the primary plat for the Blackwell 00:03:32.141 --> 00:03:39.026 - subdivision with the condition that the distance from the middle of the main drive to the individual 00:03:39.026 --> 00:03:45.502 - drives be changed to 50 feet. Petitioners, representatives are here if you have any questions. 00:03:46.370 --> 00:03:55.575 - And I'll go through the plans. This is the site plan. This is the grading plan. I put this on here so 00:03:55.575 --> 00:04:04.689 - that when petitioner's engineer comes up to speak, she can explain to you how the drainage will work 00:04:04.689 --> 00:04:14.526 - on those parcels. And this is the primary plat. And I think, yep, that's it. So if you need me to go back to 00:04:15.138 --> 00:04:25.035 - One of those, let me know. So the way we do this is we all have our discussion, then we open it up to 00:04:25.035 --> 00:04:34.933 - public comment for three minutes each. Why does it have a, why does it say 40 foot buffer on the east 00:04:34.933 --> 00:04:44.830 - side of lot four, but not on the rest of the lots? There's a 40 foot strip on all of them, I thought. 00:04:44.994 --> 00:04:53.499 - Okay. Maybe there wasn't originally, that's under the technical review meeting notes. Yeah, the one 00:04:53.499 --> 00:05:02.174 - with the retention pond on it, I requested a 40 foot strip be put on that. But there was already a 40 00:05:02.174 --> 00:05:10.849 - foot strip on the other ones? Okay. So there's a 40 foot buffer between the houses and the commercial 00:05:10.849 --> 00:05:14.846 - lots. Exactly. Will that be landscaped at all? 00:05:15.138 --> 00:05:24.089 - I didn't, I couldn't really tell from them. They'll have a mixture of, they're gonna put some along 00:05:24.089 --> 00:05:33.666 - 46 frontage, has well be requested that, and there'll be some shrubs, but I think for the 40 foot buffers, 00:05:33.666 --> 00:05:43.422 - trees at this point, that the engineer can explain that in case I'm wrong. Okay. When she comes up, not yet. 00:05:45.570 --> 00:05:55.491 - Does anybody have any questions for today's street level for the grade? Yes, part of it. Yes. Where 00:05:55.491 --> 00:06:05.610 - it goes up to behind lot one. Okay. Is the house gonna stay there? No, the house is gonna be removed. 00:06:05.610 --> 00:06:15.134 - Well, I'm here to tell you that that place is going to be a traffic hazard. It's one right now. 00:06:15.906 --> 00:06:24.200 - I've sat up there across the street from the apartments to right in and right out, and they just turn 00:06:24.200 --> 00:06:32.413 - left and away they go, okay? My question is how far from the stoplight will the drive be? We can ask 00:06:32.413 --> 00:06:40.625 - the engineer to answer that when she comes up. I'd have to look it up and she can answer it quickly. 00:06:40.625 --> 00:06:43.390 - But NDOT has given their approval 00:06:44.290 --> 00:06:53.960 - for how it has been designed. Now, put that in your packet. Well, I just think there's gotta be something 00:06:53.960 --> 00:07:03.173 - done there versus just striping on the streets. I mean, there's gotta be something, you know, I look 00:07:03.173 --> 00:07:12.478 - at Wester Street over there by Arby's, where they had the yellow piping, that's what you were to use, 00:07:13.506 --> 00:07:23.371 - to show the different ways of going in and turning left, turn right. Is there something we can do here 00:07:23.371 --> 00:07:33.333 - to do the same thing? I mean, I'm gonna tell you, people, you don't understand. You sit there and watch 00:07:33.333 --> 00:07:43.294 - them. And them people, they don't care. Nope, they don't. I've watched them. We're at 35 miles an hour. 00:07:43.650 --> 00:07:53.570 - And Zach probably can be the best one to say anything. I don't know who goes 35 besides me. Because 00:07:53.570 --> 00:08:04.085 - I'm an old man, I guess. I go 35. These people aren't going 35. And what's going to, how, is the entrance 00:08:04.085 --> 00:08:10.334 - going to be across from the other entrance where Arby's is at? 00:08:11.074 --> 00:08:20.201 - Are you ready for the engineer to come up and answer all his questions? If you had anything for me, 00:08:20.201 --> 00:08:29.418 - I can answer it. Just to clarify, this is primary plat approval. Are those issues such as the in and 00:08:29.418 --> 00:08:38.910 - out gonna be addressed at the development plan stage? Well, at this time- Or do we have to do that now? 00:08:39.170 --> 00:08:47.338 - So what they're going to be doing up on primary plat approvals applying for a grading permit. So they 00:08:47.338 --> 00:08:55.746 - can get their infrastructure and the roads built in. I don't know if the petitioner and she can probably 00:08:55.746 --> 00:09:03.833 - answer it is ready to finalize how the drive will begin with all the black top or if it's just being 00:09:03.833 --> 00:09:08.958 - cut in at this point. But those issues are ones that we address 00:09:09.122 --> 00:09:19.470 - development plan approval or not? Okay. This is just dividing the property up into four lots, basically. 00:09:19.470 --> 00:09:29.326 - Plus the development plan approval, we can also request that NDOT come out and take a look at it to 00:09:29.326 --> 00:09:36.126 - see if it adheres to how they wanted to drive before it's finalized. 00:09:37.538 --> 00:09:54.875 - So would the petitioner like to come up? I'm not sure which one is the petitioner. So this is Katie 00:09:54.875 --> 00:10:05.278 - Stein, petitioner's engineer. It's in a gradient so you can 00:10:05.570 --> 00:10:12.283 - Okay. Okay. So you can just start out with whatever you want to tell us. Okay. Yes. Good evening. Yes. 00:10:12.283 --> 00:10:18.735 - Thank you. Katie Stein with Smith Design Group. I'm the engineer for Kenny Blackwell, or Blackwell 00:10:18.735 --> 00:10:24.666 - Contractors. So thank you, Denise, described this project very pretty clearly. It's pretty 00:10:24.666 --> 00:10:31.640 - fairly straightforward. So this is only for the primary plan, the subdivision. This is not the development 00:10:31.640 --> 00:10:35.550 - plans. This is not the commercial site plan. So the plan is 00:10:35.682 --> 00:10:43.930 - do the masquerading that is shown on here that is the drive entrance up to where it stops to the lot 00:10:43.930 --> 00:10:52.178 - on the very north side. This includes the detention stormwater drainage infrastructure. This extends 00:10:52.178 --> 00:10:56.670 - sanitary sewer and water services to the site as well. 00:10:57.186 --> 00:11:03.981 - Anything regarding the driveway, NDOT, or within NDOT's right of way, that's all under the direction 00:11:03.981 --> 00:11:10.844 - of NDOT. We had contacted NDOT early on and said, hey, this is what we want to do. What do we need to 00:11:10.844 --> 00:11:15.486 - do? Can we have a driveway here? And there were no issues with them. 00:11:16.098 --> 00:11:24.432 - regarding the drive location. So this is right across the street from the drive location to the development. 00:11:24.432 --> 00:11:32.232 - I can't recall the name of it, Richland Square directly to the south. It lines up with that driveway. 00:11:32.232 --> 00:11:39.878 - So we have incorporated the improvements along State Road 46 per NDOTS requirements. So that is all 00:11:39.878 --> 00:11:44.542 - that this is being requested at this time is the subdivision 00:11:44.674 --> 00:11:53.396 - of this parcel, these two parcels into the four lots. And then the drainage. Drainage, yes. So there 00:11:53.396 --> 00:11:57.886 - is going to be a common area lot lot four that will 00:11:58.466 --> 00:12:04.639 - be able to detain and meet the stormwater requirements, with the exception of lot one, which is the 00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:10.874 - one closest to the car wash, the southwestern lot. When that comes before this board for development 00:12:10.874 --> 00:12:17.109 - plan approval, they will have to have their own detention system, water quality system at that time. 00:12:17.109 --> 00:12:23.838 - Just elevation-wise, it does not work to provide detention for that lot with the common area detention pond. 00:12:25.218 --> 00:12:31.872 - And for anyone who doesn't know, when she says NDOT, she means the Indiana Department of Transportation. 00:12:31.872 --> 00:12:38.526 - They control State Road 46. We do not. Correct. Yes. And everything that we have done for that entrance, 00:12:38.526 --> 00:12:44.989 - for that drive, has been dictated to us from them. If they want a traffic study done, they would have 00:12:44.989 --> 00:12:51.199 - told us. They would have asked us for that information. And if they had wanted different driveway 00:12:51.199 --> 00:12:54.558 - configuration, they would have told us at that time. 00:12:55.010 --> 00:13:05.122 - when we requested the information from them. Okay, do you remember what Pat's question was? I've already 00:13:05.122 --> 00:13:14.849 - forgotten. It was about the lines, how the lines will be to mark the lanes for turning out. And also 00:13:14.849 --> 00:13:23.902 - he said on Third Street, there were. Yeah, Third Street, there's yellow plastic. Dillonators. 00:13:24.354 --> 00:13:31.593 - whatever was on call. That was not mentioned at this time. We're requested from NDOT. Yeah. And then 00:13:31.593 --> 00:13:38.832 - I don't recall, I don't know the distance from the traffic signal to this driveway off the top of my 00:13:38.832 --> 00:13:46.142 - head either. So I apologize for not knowing that. What is the, what's like the overall vision for it? 00:13:46.142 --> 00:13:47.934 - Is it two businesses or? 00:13:48.290 --> 00:13:55.392 - commercial or what? It's all zone commercial, so it could be. There's been some interest with this, 00:13:55.392 --> 00:14:02.635 - but nothing set in stone as to what is going to be developed here. Yeah, I guess I was maybe thinking 00:14:02.635 --> 00:14:09.808 - farther ahead, but does Mr. Blackwell own that lot north of the car washes? The one up at the top? I 00:14:09.808 --> 00:14:17.052 - believe so, yes. Yes, and Ellis Ridge. It might benefit everyone if there was some way to incorporate 00:14:17.052 --> 00:14:18.046 - that drive to 00:14:18.818 --> 00:14:26.654 - go west and catch into that existing road? I don't know that NDOT would approve a drive connection. 00:14:26.654 --> 00:14:34.491 - I think the reason that they were okay with this driveway here is because it did not connect to any 00:14:34.491 --> 00:14:42.562 - other developments. And I would add the subdivisions being requested at this time because I think some 00:14:42.562 --> 00:14:48.126 - of the opportunities for those lots want to have the grading in place. 00:14:49.282 --> 00:14:56.058 - Because theoretically, if you connect it over to Ellis Ridge where it has the right and right out, now 00:14:56.058 --> 00:15:02.834 - you have a full access drive here. Everybody's going to come through there and now start turning left. 00:15:02.834 --> 00:15:09.412 - Not to say that they don't in Ellis Ridge, but that could potentially be even more hazard, I guess, 00:15:09.412 --> 00:15:16.188 - so to speak. And just to be clear, NDOT is the one that controls whether or not they extend that right 00:15:16.188 --> 00:15:18.622 - turn lane like exists for Kemp Road. 00:15:18.914 --> 00:15:28.240 - that's not right exactly any influence over that because I think that would help a little bit if they 00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:37.840 - extended that down to where you guys I don't that may come up when we like my microphone just like right 00:15:37.840 --> 00:15:43.326 - there didn't actually in my back I think I'm back yeah yeah 00:15:43.714 --> 00:15:51.107 - That may be something that they determined when we go through the driveway permitting process that they 00:15:51.107 --> 00:15:58.428 - want that. It seemed, what's the word I'm looking for? Because Camp Road is a road, so I think because 00:15:58.428 --> 00:16:05.608 - of that, they requested that right turn lane where this is just a drive, so they, at this time, they 00:16:05.608 --> 00:16:12.574 - have not requested that. Does it not have a standard for what Zach's talking about, a right turn, 00:16:12.770 --> 00:16:20.061 - left to right turn in, right turn out? A 30 feet, 50 foot or whatever? Yes, they do depending on, I 00:16:20.061 --> 00:16:27.716 - believe it is depending on the speed limit of the road. And then I believe it would have to be warranted 00:16:27.716 --> 00:16:35.152 - by the number of cars they would anticipate the traffic going in and out of this. But I'm not 100% on 00:16:35.152 --> 00:16:40.766 - that. That is in-dots determination. I can remember before Kemp Road and the 00:16:41.314 --> 00:16:50.379 - PUD for the apartments and then there's houses back behind the apartments. There were meetings with 00:16:50.379 --> 00:16:59.717 - NDOT engineers with what was best to do and handle that and the traffic for Kemp Road and this is what 00:16:59.717 --> 00:17:08.782 - they came up with was what's existing. So. I don't think we ever asked that question either at that 00:17:08.782 --> 00:17:10.142 - time. I don't. 00:17:10.530 --> 00:17:17.766 - It was several, not several, two or three meetings. I don't know if you were in those meetings at the 00:17:17.766 --> 00:17:25.002 - time. I was not in those meetings. But they were all on Zoom, online, and it was looking at this plan 00:17:25.002 --> 00:17:32.309 - and looking at that plan, and that's what they found the issue to us. Well, you know, not to interrupt 00:17:32.309 --> 00:17:40.254 - you, but that camp road that comes out that, I suppose, is turned right, okay, it's not from me to you. I mean, 00:17:40.706 --> 00:17:47.819 - It don't even look like it's a right-hand turnout. I mean, there's cars that just turn left and they 00:17:47.819 --> 00:17:55.002 - don't, they just basically go out a little bit of ways and turn left. I mean, that's my concern about 00:17:55.002 --> 00:18:02.325 - this corner, is that when we're gonna do it, let's do it right. I mean, if it takes a little bit longer 00:18:02.325 --> 00:18:09.438 - or if it takes something different, then let's put our heads together and figure out what we can do. 00:18:10.530 --> 00:18:21.371 - Because if it's gonna be like Camp Roll, you're gonna have a mess. Or we're gonna have a mess, Portale. 00:18:21.371 --> 00:18:31.795 - Okay, but keep in mind that the only thing we're doing tonight is dividing it into four lots. We're 00:18:31.795 --> 00:18:40.030 - not doing any of the development plan approvals or anything like that tonight. 00:18:45.282 --> 00:18:55.106 - Okay, anybody have any more questions for the petitioner or Denise? Okay, seeing none, thank you. Is 00:18:55.106 --> 00:19:05.027 - there someone from the public who wants to speak? Come on up. Sign your name on that sign-in sheet in 00:19:05.027 --> 00:19:14.462 - there and then tell us who you are. I'm Patty Jones Salter. And I live at 4285 North Centennial. 00:19:14.914 --> 00:19:24.912 - and which is the second house off of forty six and uh... but blackwell subdivision and i have some serious 00:19:24.912 --> 00:19:34.257 - concerns i feel like i have some buyers remorse right now i'd just uh... it will be a year saturday 00:19:34.257 --> 00:19:43.134 - since i bought here my husband passed and i and needed to move closer to my daughter and uh... 00:19:44.258 --> 00:19:55.207 - Soon as I got here I find out that the houses are being torn down behind me that couldn't actually see 00:19:55.207 --> 00:20:05.838 - me and Then I heard about the annexation and Then Judy Sharp raised me 50,000 over 50,000 this year 00:20:05.838 --> 00:20:13.598 - for my assessment. So Like I said, I have some buyer's remorse there but 00:20:14.466 --> 00:20:25.247 - I do have some concerns about what is going on behind me, and now this may not be applicable right now. 00:20:25.247 --> 00:20:36.028 - Just let me know. The first is, needs some mandatory privacy fencing. My bedroom, my sliding glass door 00:20:36.028 --> 00:20:42.974 - is right in the back of my house where it would, but the property. 00:20:43.266 --> 00:20:56.678 - I'm asking, I was going to say a six to eight foot fence, but the properties, both of them go down in 00:20:56.678 --> 00:21:11.011 - a gully, so that wouldn't work, to provide some privacy. Also, and you were talking about a buffer easement, 00:21:11.011 --> 00:21:13.246 - now I don't know 00:21:13.570 --> 00:21:25.534 - I was against having any commercial waste dumpsters, loading docks and parking lots budding my property. 00:21:25.534 --> 00:21:37.043 - And also lighting. My neighbor, it doesn't affect me, but my neighbor who couldn't be here, she just 00:21:37.043 --> 00:21:42.398 - had surgery yesterday, but she was saying that 00:21:42.786 --> 00:21:54.789 - The lights even from the car wash affects her. They don't affect me, but they do her. And she is the 00:21:54.789 --> 00:22:06.911 - first house off of 46. So wanted to make sure that any future commercial establishments have downward 00:22:06.911 --> 00:22:11.902 - lighting, downward and shielded lighting. 00:22:12.226 --> 00:22:23.435 - to prevent it from bleeding into our homes there. And I know if it's apartments going up, there's going 00:22:23.435 --> 00:22:34.212 - to be windows probably that's going to be looking right in my home. So I am concerned about what is 00:22:34.212 --> 00:22:40.894 - happening there. But I have no concerns at all about somebody 00:22:41.058 --> 00:22:48.768 - developing their property, and I respect that, but I do have those concerns, and I just wanted the Planning 00:22:48.768 --> 00:22:56.265 - Commission to take that into consideration. Thank you. Okay, thank you. And once again, those are things 00:22:56.265 --> 00:23:03.618 - that we talk about at the development plan stage. However, we do have lightning standards that they're 00:23:03.618 --> 00:23:10.686 - required to maintain. It's supposed to stay away from the residential property. If the car wash is 00:23:10.882 --> 00:23:18.226 - causing problems with your area. They can have our inspector look at it and make sure that they're meeting 00:23:18.226 --> 00:23:25.365 - the requirements. The thing about a car wash, so our lighting standards mainly talk about like the pole 00:23:25.365 --> 00:23:32.297 - lights that light up the parking lot. It's kind of different with the car wash because it's all, the 00:23:32.297 --> 00:23:39.710 - car wash itself is all lit up. So I don't really know how that applies in the standards, but they can have, 00:23:40.514 --> 00:23:47.169 - our inspector look at it and make sure that they're meeting the requirements. And then about dumpsters, 00:23:47.169 --> 00:23:54.016 - privacy fences, those kinds of things are all things we talk about at the development plan stage. However, 00:23:54.016 --> 00:24:00.415 - you might want to get with the young lady there and express your concerns to her about whether they 00:24:00.415 --> 00:24:07.070 - can put a bunch of shrubs in there or whatever before they come back to us with their development plan. 00:24:07.070 --> 00:24:08.158 - Okay. Thank you. 00:24:10.530 --> 00:24:26.830 - Anybody else? Seeing none, as soon as I can find my piece of paper where I made notes at, I will make 00:24:26.830 --> 00:24:40.094 - a motion that we approve case PC26-25 with the condition that the plans be revised 00:24:40.450 --> 00:24:50.776 - following the plan to demonstrate compliance with the fire department's 50 foot access requirements 00:24:50.776 --> 00:25:01.618 - for lots one and two. Okay, we have a motion. The second roll call please. David Drake. Yes. Steve Hale. 00:25:01.618 --> 00:25:07.710 - Yes. Zach Michael. Yes. Pat Wesolowski. No. Motion passed. 00:25:11.426 --> 00:25:25.029 - Oh, we do? Oh. So, it's a no action vote, so it rolls over to the next plan commission. I just thought 00:25:25.029 --> 00:25:38.236 - it was of the majority, so. It's a majority. My bad. It's okay, it's a majority of the board, not a 00:25:38.236 --> 00:25:41.406 - majority of the quorum. 00:25:42.530 --> 00:25:52.836 - So in order for there to be a final decision from a planning commission or BZA, it has to be a majority 00:25:52.836 --> 00:26:02.747 - of the board membership. So you have no final decision basically. So it just rolls over to the next 00:26:02.747 --> 00:26:12.062 - meeting. Okay. Next item on our agenda is planning department update. Next meeting's October. 00:26:12.706 --> 00:26:22.135 - First, there will be new business and this will carry over if they're ready. And that's about it. Privits 00:26:22.135 --> 00:26:31.385 - of the floor. Anybody want to say anything that wasn't on our agenda? Plan, commission, comments? None, 00:26:31.385 --> 00:26:33.342 - and we are adjourned.