call to order the special meeting of October 23rd, 2025 the election board. I'm not sure how we adopt
the agenda. It looks like it's there and it looks like it's OK to me. I will make a motion to adopt
the agenda as described. Second. Those of in favor I I oppose no. OK, approval of the minutes from October 2nd.
I have reviewed the minutes. I will make a motion to approve the minutes. I'll second that. In favor,
aye. Aye. I have some discussion first, please. Okay, discussion, go ahead. First of all, I did not
speak about my concerns about the 2024 provisional hearing whatsoever. I was concerned about the number
of the provisional ballots from the twenty twenty four and what caused them so I feel that that's incorrect
and I also requested that we test more than a minimum number of machines in twenty twenty six to avoid
the problems that we're seeing at one of the voting centers- polling places rather in twenty twenty
four I sent this. Out to you this morning after I found out
The minutes, that was not on the website. The agenda was not on the website. I checked just a short
time ago. The agenda is on the website. It was posted yesterday morning at 10 AM. I'll have you show
me later if that's OK. Yep. But I cannot in good conscience have minutes that do not reflect what was
actually said. So I would move to amend the minutes.
to indicate that I spoke about my concerns about the provisional ballots and that I requested more than
a minimum number of machines to be tested. Do the minutes come directly from, I'm going to just use
in quotes, the tape? Yes, they do. They come from the recording from the CATS
We directly, the individual who does the minutes, directly watches those, goes back, and then we also
follow through with the transcript that is created from each of those recordings as well. And how much
judgment is used on how to, and I hate to use the word summarize. I don't like that word, but it may
be appropriate here. How much judgment is used in what we put in the minutes?
When she does the minutes, she does them, she sends them to me and then they're also sent to Nicole.
We review them and then once they're reviewed by us, then they get passed on to the election board for
another set of review. Nicole, if you want to speak on that a little bit. So, I mean, I can't, I echo
what you said. We take the minutes directly from watching the meeting
It is not a word for word. That's not the purpose of minutes. The very definition of minutes is it is
a snapshot of what occurred. And then we provide the link to the meeting so that if you want the word
by word, blow by blow, play by play, so to speak, then you can watch for edification and clarification.
And then also for the record, the transcripts are with the recording as well. VIN from TSD works to
make sure that those transcripts are there for anybody that would like them. So what you're telling
us, just to make sure we've got this clear and on the record, your office listens to the transcript,
watches the video, whatever.
And then summarizes the high points. That's what we look at. However, it is. Easy to get to an exact
word by word. Yes, if they want to do that correct. OK, I haven't been involved with a whole bunch of
organizations that do minutes OK. Has that is that what you're telling me? Is that long standing?
Yeah, the way that the minutes are being transcribed now have been the same for years. Nicole would
know more in extent. I've been here since late 2023, and it's been the same since I arrived. I'm not
objecting to the fact that it's not a word for word.
because certainly I talked about the types of ballots that were rejected, the numbers. I'm not raising
any of that as an objection. I'm objecting to the fact that it says that I had concerns about the provisional
hearing, which I did not, and that I also did raise this other issue about the machine testing. And
so if you're not satisfied that I have this corrected,
I'm representing this correctly. I suggest that we table the approval of the minutes until the next
meeting. And I will happily go back through the recording and let you know exactly where those statements
occurred. Do you have printed copies? I looked at it this morning of what you sent to us. I did not
print that off. I didn't see that till I was somewhere where I could not get here. Yes, I do.
in there too but no actually it's fine I get typos happen yeah that's all I'm asking for is those changes
I'm not asking for a word-for-word transcript so is your motion that to amend to include what we have
under new business in red toward the bottom yes
Does that, and I'm gonna use the fun word, does that mess up what you've done if we add that to it?
No, it would just be taking the revised copy and then if there was a typo, just having that amended
before the minutes are brought back next election board meeting to be re-approved. Actually, I didn't
see a typo, sorry. I'd mine.
Is adding this totally away from what customarily you put in minutes and you've done for quite some
time? Nicole, I'll refer to you. I'm sorry. Please. Is adding this totally out of the norm for what
we've done or what you've done for minutes in the past? This is one of a very few times that
the summary has actually been questioned. So it would be out of the norm in that it just doesn't happen
very often. But if you want to second the motion to me. I don't have a huge issue with adding this,
but I think we need to we need to be clear from here that the minutes are a summary. The actual wording
is available.
I don't particularly want to read every word that was said again before we can approve minutes, but
I don't have any problem with it. So you've seconded the motion. But if you would, she's got she's got
a motion to amend on the floor. It has not received a second. I'll give it a second. OK, OK.
Those in favor. I. Those opposed. Motion carries.
So now we go back. Now, are the minutes now considered to be approved? No. No. So I will entertain a
motion to approve the minutes as amended. We can approve the minute. Oh, sorry. I think the amendment
already took care of that. Well, that's what I just asked them to make sure. Molly, I'm going to make
sure. OK. All right. So then we need the minute.
just so everybody's clear. Yay on approval of the minutes. Minutes are approved as amended. Okay.
All right. And that's passed now. Okay. Are there public comments on things that are not listed on the
agenda? There are none. We'll move on. The
update on the showers project. Mr. Kreider. Good afternoon board members, Richard Kreider, Monroe County
building and fleet manager. I'm here today to give you an update on the early voting renovation at the
showers building. We're approaching the 11th month on this project. I'll give you a little history of it.
In January and February, I began meeting with the clerk, clerk's deputy and voting supervisor to discuss
voting operations, space needs, concerns and project goals. In March, the commissioners approved
a professional services contract with Spring Point Architects. April began the design and development
phase, which ran through the end of March. To me, this was the funnest part so far because we took all
of the information that we had gathered over the previous months.
gave that to the architect. We started with an empty footprint and came to the final design. And I want
to give some props to Ms. Ferris and Mr. White for the information that they provided. It was extremely
helpful. Another notable event in March was that we emptied the storage unit in Eltsville and relocated
those items to the showers building in suite 202.
As part of this renovation project, those items will be relocated to the first floor in the new storage
slash equipment maintenance room, easily accessible from the east entrance of the building. We recently
completed the bidding phase. The plan is to have the contract executed at the next commissioner's meeting
on the 30th of this month with construction beginning in November and running through January. Now,
That's when this project is complete, the voters registration folks at Johnson will have already been
busy doing important work for the upcoming primary. So my thought on this is that even though the suite
would be complete in January, that we not move the voters registration office over until after the primary.
Now I know
A few people have asked about that and maybe think it's not a great idea. I've been asked at a council
meeting and had the press reach out and ask about it. So if you guys have any questions or comments,
I'll answer what I can and get back with you later on what I can. I had to be in Indianapolis on Monday.
Could you clarify?
My understanding is that there is a tenant expected to move into what is now election central. And so
I've never, I personally have never seen a construction and design project actually on time, unless
there was a monetary incentive. Like if you get this done by the deadline, we'll pay you, we'll give
you some bonus money.
you know, deadlines come and go. And the concern for me, obviously, is being in two different places,
because we don't have a home. We can't go to the new place, but we can't stay in the old place. So if
you'll clarify for me, as far as the tenant that is expected to take? Nobody's moving into Johnson Hardware.
My voter's registration is there. OK. And in my mind,
This isn't, and we talked about this on Monday. You can weigh in if you'd like, but I don't see this
as being any different than early voting at the former NAPA location, voters registration at Johnson
Hardware. I think we're in the same scenario and we can move after the primary or we can move after the
the election. I prefer to do it after the primary. I think that makes the most sense. But the other
piece to that isn't really a factor for me. So what you're saying, it is possible to leave Election
Central right where it is, through the primary, without anybody wanting to kick them out, and then move,
I assume shortly after the primary, June, July, whatever, into the new facility. Is that
That's correct. I think we'd be moving in June. Unless this has changed since the council meeting, and
I'm not aware that it has, someone looked at Election Central and there was conversations about them
potentially moving in the space, but there wasn't a concrete, yes, you're doing this. So I don't think
we have a tenant moving in. I think that
It really, it's not a factor. It's not a factor with this project. You can see the optics from my perspective
in that one day I get a call from my election supervisor wondering why people have shown up to view
a space that we, I mean, there was no, hey, we're coming over, got some people who want to look at this
thing. Sure, that was very confusing. It was very confusing and no follow up, no, sorry, kiss my foot, nothing.
So how, I mean, the optics look like you got a tenant. And where are we going to be if they, you know,
if they're signing the lease? I'm sorry that happened. Thank you. Thank you. That's fine. We've got
a plan. We're going to say where we are through probably June and move after June to the new facility.
And anybody that asks, that's the lie. I don't want to say the lie. That's the story you're going to
tell them, correct?
Yeah, I was also going to say, depending on when the construction is completed in January, if it's after
the candidate filing, we have about a two-week space of time that we could transition to the new space
before the primary. But I don't want to stick pressure on you guys to get that done for that. I don't
want to burden your office with that. I think that's a lot.
I think it's going to be, I don't know, we've done a few moves. You run into things. It's unfortunate
that the space would be finished and empty for that amount of time. That is unfortunate. We talked about
possibly you can move some things over there that aren't critical to your operation at that time. But
I feel like it's like you said, it's a lot of extra pressure. I don't think we need to
Apply to the situation. It's not broken if you know so we don't need to fix that. I would have no issue
with that with that plan that the plan is to stay put through. May you know through the primary and
then move start moving stuff in June, which gives you plenty of time before we need to have stuff going
for the November election. I to me that makes sense.
I think so, too. Thank you. Thank you. We've done this a little different. Anybody, anyone have comment
on this plan? All right, then we'll move on. Thank you, sir. We'll move back on to the revisit of the
motion that Ms. Givens made at the October meeting. As I would like to actually amend my motion,
that the time frame that. I move that we get the Monroe county election board hold two public hearings
on vote centers based upon the plan created by Monroe county vote center study committee earlier this
year and according to Indiana law with the second hearing to be held on or before November the twenty
sixth. Twenty twenty five.
Just get it all out in front. There is zero reason to have these hearings because my constituency, my
chairman are not the least bit interested in going to vote centers. We're not the only county that's
turned them down. Habbleton County just did the same thing. There's not a huge demand for these in the
county. You sent out $3,000 with postcards.
and less than one half of one percent of the people that got those thought it was important enough to
even take a picture and fill out a form. So you can talk about this if you want, but we're not going
to go to vote centers and the foreseeable future of Monroe County is just not going to happen. So you're
saying that there is absolutely nothing that would persuade you to change your mind. My mind has been
is I don't see any reason for him personally, but I have a constituency and they have zero desire for these.
So on the Indiana Secretary of State's website, and please keep in mind that there has been a Republican
in that seat for over 30 years, one can find information on vote centers. One benefit of vote centers,
according to the website, is that vote centers offer flexibility and convenience to voters by allowing
them to cast a ballot at any county location of their choosing on election day. In 2010, 15 years ago,
The Indiana Fiscal Policy Institute issued a report on vote centers. The Secretary of State's website
indicates the key findings of this study include, vote centers can produce significant savings for counties
that implement them. Vote centers give local election officials more flexibility. Vote centers can produce
immediate and long-term savings. This study finds savings could result
every election day as well as when time comes to purchase new equipment and vote centers will significantly
reduce the machines needed. In 2013 then Indiana Secretary of State Connie Lawson traveled the state
to discuss vote centers with county clerks and other officials. She collected feedback from current
vote center clerks and those that attended the regional vote center meetings. In 2013 alone four additional
counties moved to
vote centers, and there have been 57 more since then. Cass, Tippecanoe, and Wayne counties were the
first counties in Indiana to pilot the vote centers. In 2013, the clerks of these three counties were
on a panel to discuss their experience with the vote centers, and all this can be found at the Secretary
of State's website. You can click on the questions that they were asked.
The clerks were Republican Joanne Stewart of Wayne County, Republican Beth Lemming of Cass County, and
Republican Krista Coffey of Tippecanoe County. These three clerks all supported vote centers, saying
they provided fiscal savings, fewer poll workers were needed, which made recruitment easier, fewer poll
workers meant they could do a more thorough job training poll workers, fewer locations were needed,
and they felt there was a
there was better voter access because they weren't turning voters away who came to the wrong polling
place. They also reported that voters were happy with vote centers and were supportive of maintaining
them. So also included in some of the reports I've read, having vote centers does not significantly
change voter turnout. It is issues and candidates that drive that.
of the ballot. And as indicated on October the second. In twenty twenty four there were voters in Monroe
county who attempted to vote at the incorrect polling places. And these voters had their ballots rejected.
There were also instances of voters being given either an incorrect ballot or provisional ballot both
of which might have been avoided with more intense training. In fact the clerk in in Wayne county said
that if they needed to they
your poll workers. And for many years, there has been a problem recruiting poll workers here for election
day, and especially on the Republican side. So please keep in mind, too, that Republicans in Indiana
favor vote centers, which is reflected in the fact that currently 71, this is an update from just a
few days ago, 71 of the 92 counties in Indiana, meaning over three quarters of the counties, have vote
centers. And that the Republican supermajority
in the Indiana legislature, ask the Secretary of State to conduct public meetings regarding the will
of the people to implement this voting mechanism. So I've asked for this because I feel there's a potential
to increase voter convenience, save taxpayer money, improve poll worker training, and hopefully reduce
the number of provisional ballots cast on election day. Thank you.
I'm not asking for the hearings. I'm not asking for a vote center vote. There is zero purpose to drag
people into a hearing because it's not going to change if they want to come in and talk great.
I don't care, but. I work through my chairman. The people that work in work that are active in my party.
They have given me 100% literally the ones I've talked to that they're against this and we're not going
to change our vote because of that.
When my constituency tells me they want it, then we'll consider changing the vote or when the law changes.
I've spoken to both, two of the three candidates for Secretary of State. Neither one of them are interested
in forcing this on different counties. Counties can make their own choice. I've spoken to them personally.
There's no reason to have hearings.
There's just no reason, because we're not, there's nothing that you've said that makes me think, gee,
we have to do this. There's nothing you've said that makes our chairman think we have to do this. The
groups that I represent are not interested in this. So you're not interested in saving money for the
county? You said can save money. You didn't say will save money. And there's a difference in can and will.
And the counties that have instituted they have saved money to contact them and get the numbers. No,
you don't need to do that. Okay, you don't need to do that. So you're also not interested in
voter convenience. Convenience is an interesting term. Okay. You know what, my first ballot was cast in 1970.
I've moved several times. I never once have had any issue finding out where to vote. It's not that difficult.
In fact, it's easier now than it was back then because all of us have these little computers in our
hands that it's very easy to type in, where do I vote? I've done it a couple of times with different
advisors just to see. It's not difficult. The website's not difficult. It's not difficult to call the
office and find out where they are.
You know, and I, truthfully, if someone that just shows up election day has done nothing beforehand
anywhere, I don't really feel sorry for them. You're out of order. I will get to comment, you're out
of order. You're out of order. If something gets me. Procedurally, I think this is where we are. There's
been a motion in no second. Without a second, the motion's going to die.
Is there a second? For the purposes of wrapping up this discussion, what I understood from the last
election board meeting was that you were going to reach out to the Secretary of State directly
for information that might be helpful today. Yes, ma'am, and I have done that.
I did not see, if you want to report out on that, I think that would be helpful. I called him that evening
on the way to the other meeting I have on the first Thursday night of the month. He called me back within
five minutes and said his personal choice is precinct voting because it's more secure in his mind, and
that the only reason he held these hearings was because a legislative committee had asked him to do so.
He did. He did that again. He did not anticipate. Vote centers being mandated on the counties. Now again,
that's he did not anticipate based on his discussions with the members of the General Assembly. That's
the same question of the gentleman that Knox County chair who's also running for Secretary of State.
His answer was very similar.
not reached out to the gentleman who's running who doesn't live around here so it's hard to get a hold
of me. So the other the only other question that I would ask because I have similar concerns to have
two public hearings and ask people to leave their dinner tables leave their families if the vote is
not going to change that does not seem prudent at the same time. I hear what you're saying today in
terms of your party chair
your constituents. I'm just asking this out loud. I serve at the pleasure of my county chair. That makes
I didn't go looking for this trust me. I understand. So let me ask you and his his comment right now
is, and I'm not going to get into the nuts and bolts of it. The way our party has been treated in so
many different things.
there's really no reason to change this. For example, we had to file a lawsuit to get a city
board appointment that was ours by statute because the city council wouldn't see them. That person has
since run for office as a Democrat. We had to do the same thing to get our person on the county health board.
even though it's sat empty for quite some time. So when we get some cooperation ourselves as a party
on those kind of things, we might be willing to talk about these kind of things. We don't have a great
deal of power, but we're going to use what power we have. And at this point in time, I'm directed, OK,
I'm going to vote the way my party tells me, regardless of my thoughts on it, which had this happened
the last time, it wouldn't be in this position anyway.
Until I get told differently, my vote's going to be no. And that's why there's no reason to bring people
out here. The other thing is, for special meetings, I've discovered, as I've looked around things, the
chair can call special meetings. This is by election law, what I've been told, can call special meetings,
but does not have to allow them if passed for by somebody else.
That's got very little to do with this right now other than I just see no reason to do it. I don't want
to drag people out here. I don't want to drag your staff out of here. I don't want to drag the attorney
and her staff out of here. There's no reason to. So again, to just continue the discussion because we're
here. So if I understand you correctly,
it is not likely that your party chair is going to release you to, even if you personally supported
vote centers, your party chair is not going to release you from voting for them because- That would
be correct. My chair was supposed to meet Kylie with you as well as the other chair where they were
supposed to meet with you at some point. Correct. They could have those kinds of discussions at that
point in time if they wanted to.
But I did my own research to find out what I thought before the May meeting. But I voted in accordance
with the direction I was given by the county chair. So then finally, Mr. Chair, it appears to me that
there are people who are here to make some kind of comment. And so would you be open while we have absolutely
to hear the people who have come this way and then
that we can have the vote. Fine. But I mean they may or may not want to speak, but I do see people in
the audience. That's fine. So if there is, if there are people who still want to comment. Feel free.
I'm Ashley Kierberg. You might remember me. I wanted to like... Yes, you've called me a liar and said
I slept through these meetings. I've read that. Okay, that's fine. You know what you also read? That
you lied to the B Square. You lied to him because you posted a whole data sheet about the data about
the vote centers across the state, right? You did. And you mentioned a lot of the counties which had
vote centers. They actually didn't. How about the years that you posted?
They didn't do it either. That came from state land. I'm trying to talk right now. Please don't talk
over me. What I'm trying to get at is that you are trying to use a data sheet. And it makes it seem
like you did a lot of research, right? You didn't. Because lying to the B-squared journalist just shows
the research you're doing is skewed. So I just wanted you to know a data sheet that's flawed is still
flawed. So Brown County that you listed,
They didn't have one. Their Republican is actually listening to all constituents, to all people. What
if there's somebody who's like, you know what? I want to be a Republican. I don't know. But they're
listening to them, too. Did you talk to Brown County before you wrote their name down? No, you didn't.
But you might want to tell the truth whenever a data sheet's flawed. So I think that that's important,
as anybody here and anybody watching and anywhere else in this county, that you knew at the very beginning
speed it up to spring that you were going to say no. So continuing to have me, I have five children.
You know that. And I'm sitting there telling you that I saw something immediately. I'm a campaign manager,
and I will look at all these data sheets. And immediately, I knew within seconds, I didn't have to do
much research for that one. And I was like, Brown County doesn't have one. Lie. Tipton, all these years
were not true. The percentages, you know why people don't vote often?
The reason why these numbers are not listed, because of uncontested races. Did you know that? Okay,
so the answer would probably be no. So what I'm trying to say is uncontested races are not going to
drive the voters there. So maybe we should get out contested races. You want to put more people in Monroe
County? Get it contested. Let's high five it. Let's do it. But what I'm saying is all across the state,
there is people
that want vote centers. I campaign in Morgan County. And how many times am I like, hey, go to Morgantown.
Hey, go over here. And all of the people get excited, because they don't have to wait an hour in line.
They could have children. They could have a blue collar job that they can't leave. And they can go five,
10 minutes and go down the road, and they can vote. So using your power, just so we can all laugh, so
you can just laugh at the people, it's very laughable when your data sheet's flawed.
So thank you. Thank you for your time. My data sheet came from data. I'm responding to you. Yeah,
go ahead. Stay where you are. My data sheet came directly from state of Indiana. That's wild, because
the state of Indiana is exactly where I found information. That's where mine came from. What website
are you using? Because it's very different than the Indiana Secretary of State. I worked on mine with
a prior person, a prior member of this board. Yeah.
He helped me get it. I didn't look at it. Yeah. So you didn't do the research on it. Indiana Secretary
of Website actually shows all of it. I used other people. So thank you for seeking out. You're welcome.
Thank you. I just want to let you know. Thanks. Can I ask a question? Yeah, I know. Do you serve as
a poll worker for us? I don't, not yet. But right now, I'm in advocacy and campaign managing. So that's
what I do. Thank you. Thanks.
My name is Laramie Wilson. I'm a Monroe County resident and retired election and voter registration
staff. I support vote centers with a smaller footprint, meaning smaller number precincts than was voted
on last summer.
These would promise to reduce costs, but more importantly, most importantly, give Monroe County voters
the accessibility of voting that the majority of the Indiana counties now delivers to their voters.
In voting against the vote centers, board member Shields said, and these are direct quotes, I did my
own research with people I represent.
Second quote, literally zero were in favor of vote centers. Their concerns were about why should it
be easier for non-residents to vote? If people pay out of state tuition, they are not residents of Monroe
County. I would like to remind the appointed board members that they are not here to represent their parties.
and in light also of comments made today by board member Shields. As appointed county election board
members, you took an oath of office that said, I will support the constitution of the United States
and of the state of Indiana and will faithfully, honestly, and impartially, I'm emphasizing impartially,
discharge my duties as a member of this county election board. The Constitution of the state of Indiana
says that in the courts and the statutes which interpret it says that they determine who are eligible
voters in the state of Indiana. The eligibility is based on citizenship, age, and residency.
and the Indiana Code states that students who live in Monroe County while at school are eligible residents
to be eligible as voters in Monroe County and in the state of Indiana. So I ask that the board, Monroe
County Election Board, cast your votes in accordance with the Constitution and the Indiana Code
in the state of Indiana and with your oath of office, which you took to uphold impartiality. And I urge
you to adopt vote centers to give Monroe County voters the voting accessibility in line with the rest
of the state. Thank you.
My name is Kathy Ruark, and for about nine years, I've been involved working at early voting. I'm actually
in favor of having voting centers for at least the last couple of weeks of early voting. It's more convenient
for the voters. And as opposed to election day, if you come in to vote during early voting and you didn't
bring something that you should have, something's not right.
That issue can be corrected. You can find out what you need. Go home and either come back that day or
the next day. It's just more convenient for voters. Also, and that would decrease the number of provisional
ballots. If you have voting centers in certain areas, elderly people who really want to vote in person,
they're not quite ready.
to ask for a travel board, then it would be more convenient for them to get to the voting place.
And also, if they come one year with a caregiver to assist them, that's an opportunity for the staff
at that voting center to educate them on next year or next election. You might want to consider asking
for the travel board just to get that information out.
I believe that it should be convenient for people to vote, and that voting centers would help with that.
Kathy, thank you for your service. You are an integral part of early voting, and we are incredibly grateful
for all that you do. Thank you so much. Hi, I'm Regina Moore, also a resident of Monroe County. I have
not moved.
my home in the past 40 years maybe, maybe longer. I voted at six different precinct locations, six different
polling sites. And I voted at three different early voting sites. Things move around in this county
election to election. But we are the nerds. We will find where we're going to vote no matter what.
I have voted from a farmhouse in Italy. I have voted from a condo in Florida during COVID. And you found
me, and I appreciate that. Thank you. But I think it is in the, and of course, I'm a favorite of those
centers. In this discussion,
And in the voting for vote centers, the propensity to approve or not approve them, I think it's really
a little disingenuous to look at the way the Democratic Party has treated the Republican Party in a
separate area of government within a city board appointment. That doesn't make sense to me. That's not
what we're here for.
That's somebody else's position. Whether you pay tuition in state or out of state at a local institution,
that's a different level of government. That's not what we're here for. Frankly, we moved here to go
to school. My first vote was at the Unionville School, 1972. And oh, I take that back. I've had more
than one place, yes.
We were happy to vote here, but my husband wasn't considered an in-state student. He was an out-of-state
student. We registered our car here and had license plates. We owned a home here. We had a child in
school here. And yet, according to what you said, Mr. Shields, because we paid out-of-state tuition,
we didn't belong here.
We weren't a resident here. If you pay out of state tuition, you're not a resident here. That's not
taking into consideration how many people live here all year long and may just still pay out of state
tuition. Because once you start a degree at IU without a state tuition, that's your designation until
you finish that degree. I also think it's a little bit disingenuous to start acting like the Republican
and Democratic Party on the national level.
We have people in Congress who say, no matter what, no. No, I'm not changing my mind. No, no. And that's
what I'm seeing here. And I don't like it. We are Bloomington. We're Monroe County. And we can do better.
Thank you. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, Madam Clerk.
Madam board member, sorry, my voice here. My name's John Lettner. I'm a almost 40-year resident of Perry
Township, a retiree from General Motors in Bedford for 38 years working there. Since I retired, I've
become an election official, working every election, primary and general since 2020. I got a little
bit of a unique perspective in that I work
early voting and on Election Day. And I understand there's preferences about, well, we don't think early
voting is... that regardless, that you can own that. But the problems as an early voting lead and an
Election Day poll inspector are similar.
Not a day goes by without several voters showing up to vote in person. They want to vote in person,
and they fail to meet some qualification. But on Election Day, there's no second chance, and primarily
on Election Day, it's people at the wrong polling site. I think the causes
things are confusing the voters. They have the right idea in mind, but even as a poll worker or poll
lead, I work through Monday before election day under one set of guidelines, and I gotta get up at four
in the morning on Tuesday, go to be a poll inspector, and tell all these people what to do in a different
set of guidelines.
I mean, I signed up for it, but the voting center idea is a solution to some of the confusion. That's
why I stand here today in favor of it, because I think it's less confusing for the voters and the workers.
You know, why not simplify? I wrote down here that we have 65 of our counties already doing it, and
I guess since I wrote that, it became 71. It just seems... how about this term? Common sense. Don't
people like to use that term nowadays? And if you don't believe me,
ask the people in the other counties. They could go back, as I understand. I don't know that any have.
And lastly, thank you, Laramie, because we got to quit being elected and appointed people, doing what
our party tells us to do, and start doing it the other way. Thank you for your time.
Mr. Ledner, I want to also thank you for your service. You, too, have been an amazing part of early
voting for years now. I can't remember an election in recent past that you haven't been a major tour
de force with early voting. And for that, I want to express my gratitude. Mr. Chair, I don't see anybody
else who might want to make public comment. I don't know about online.
So okay, so then I guess that for the purpose of again wrapping up this discussion, my presumption is
that in the same way that vote centers would have to have a unanimous vote that to move forward with
public hearings, we would have to have. Not according to the law I read according to what law you read
election law. Go ahead.
I do not think the vote to move forward with having the public hearings required is required to be unanimous,
but you are correct that the implementation or approval of a vote center plan would have to be unanimous.
I contacted man coach or. At the state about what would need what we would need to do in this regard,
and he said that we only need a majority to do the hearings. I'd be happy to share that email with you.
No, he's funding the phone numbers in my phone too. Oh, sure. So then I guess that where I am is it
does not feel right to ask people to come out if, I mean, my vote isn't changing either. I support unanimous
to turn all of our polling sites into vote centers and not redo. So my vote isn't going to change either.
to vote. I mean, two votes have already they've said my vote isn't going to change. You were asking
people leave your home. Leave your dinner table. Leave your kids and come out and it's going to end
up the same. What moves the needle? It's what would move the needle for Mr Shields and made very clear
his party chair is not going to release him to
the people who appointed him to this board. That is correct. I am very, very disheartened that there
are people who say that there is nothing that would ever, ever change their mind. I just find that very
disheartening. I'm sorry you feel that way.
Being in a position to make decisions that some people don't like I've done for over 50 years. It really
it it is what it is. And I I'm not you can have the hearings. But until I get it until the people that
I and and. Taking things out of context is just as just as. Or decision making as.
other stuff is. I went to multiple groups that were Republican groups, and I said, you tell me what
you want me to vote. And it was literally, that's why I used the word literally, unanimous, that they
don't want them in Monroe County. They did not like the plan. They didn't like the fact that there was
nothing in that plan that would preclude
The office, the board, the whatever from pulling them to save money from out in the county and centralizing
them. There was nothing in that plan that that required this many. They did not want it. They did not
want it to be centralized around the University. There's nothing to stop that. There's a lot of stuff
that you know I understand people that want to talk about
residents or not residents. I have a problem with, honestly, I have a problem with people that don't
pay property taxes voting on referendums to raise property taxes, you know, because it doesn't affect
them. So they're really, until I can get people that I'm, I hate to say represent, but that fits as
well as anything, until we get a change in attitude or philosophy from them, there's nothing that's
going to change the way we vote.
I can say no pretty easily. I've done it for a long time. I can say yes when it comes time.
Are you OK? I thought you wanted to say something. I do, but I don't want to interrupt, too. No,
go ahead. I know that you've moved past the public comment period, and so I don't know if you want to
reopen it, but I did want to draw your attention that there's a hand online. I believe it's. Oh,
thank you. Thank you. I wasn't looking at that.
We can go ahead and take it. We have a public comment. It's I'm not sure who it is. A lot of stonebreaker
who would share the okay votes are coming a lot of go ahead. Yeah, I just had a comment on that. The
vote center plan did say that we that there was a stipulation that the the county keep a vote center
in every. In in in each of the.
the 13, sorry, I'm forgetting the term for it, but our subsets. The townships. The townships.
Thank you. Sorry, my brain. In each of the townships, so there was mechanisms in place to make sure
that there were not any focusing on those locations, as well as there was a focus on their
about eliminating redundancy in physical locations. So circulating them around the campus wouldn't make
sense because one of the goals is to have them physically separate from each other to eliminate redundancy.
So I just wanted to make sure that that was included because that was included in the plan presented.
Thank you. Thank you. So I go back to I understood
that his vote was not going to change at the last meeting. You called this special meeting. He's indicated
today that his vote is not going to change, that he doesn't anticipate. Is there something that you're
anticipating if we have these public hearings and we ask these people to come out that is going to turn
this around so that we walk away? My crystal ball doesn't work very well. I don't know what people might
come and say.
That would be the reason that I would want to have the hearings. I watched the stuff that occurred earlier
this year. I have been paying attention very strongly. But there may be other people who feel that their
voices, that they didn't understand that they should have spoken up. I can't predict what will be said
or not said. Yeah. I just know that in 2020,
18, Morgan County went to vote centers. They halved the number of polling places. In 2022, Jackson County
moved down to just six vote centers. There was absolutely no complaint about people feeling inconvenienced
or having problems getting to places. And Jackson County, many parts of that are very rural. It's been
just within the last few months that
Brown County has now gone ahead with the vote center stuff. And that was not on the Secretary of State's
website that I saw two weeks ago, but it is up there now. So I'm just saying that I don't know what
people might say. But again, I want to point out that the potential for saving money, it's Republicans
that talk about waste and fraud, waste and fraud, waste and fraud. I think this is a waste of money
to not have vote centers.
Maybe you should ask your county council to put together a plan that shows exactly where they put them
and how much money they'd save. Bring that back. The county council does not do that. County council
handles the money. But it's the county commissioners that approve. They have the commissioners do it.
And then let me take that back to my leadership and they might change their mind.
One thing I would say that does kind of concern me about reopening the vote center discussions is that
it would be with the same plan that was already voted down. My thought is if you're wanting to reopen this
recreate a plan. They can start based off of the plan that already exists, but work on that one,
fine tune it, find the information that Danny is specifically asking for and move forward from there
so that the information can be portrayed in a different way so it's not the exact same plan that's being
voted on. With my understanding, and perhaps I am not remembering correctly, but they laid out three
different options
I believe. They recommended one, but they didn't dismiss having either of the other two also acted upon.
And with regard to recommending where the vote center should be, I hope that the clerk will clarify
this if I'm misspeaking. In the past, what has happened is that people from the election division have
made recommendations about where the polling site is, and then
commissioners give final approval on that. So it's backwards to say, let's have the commissioners do
it. What I said with the commissioners, show us how they're going to save the money. If we're talking
about it being a money saver. You don't seem to understand how county government works. I don't have
as many years in county government as you do. I really admit that. Mr. Chair, let me ask you this.
if we were to consider the other option, which was not the universal, but to reduce it to 20? There
was a plan for 29, 22, and 20. OK. So let's meet in the middle, 22. Would you be more open to let my
leadership look at that? 22 was the one that was voted on at the last hearing. OK.
What are the dates that you're proposing for the public hearings? I don't know when this room was available.
That's what I was saying. I just would like to have it before late November to give us time to look
at this in December. We not only have to come up with two dates, we'd have to send out public notice
again. We'd have to send out public notice. We could do in the newspaper only.
The last time that we did it, we had also added in the postcards. It's my understanding. Maybe I can
find the email from Mr. Kochevar. But the first hearing doesn't have to have a big notice. It's the
second one that has to occur at least 30 days after to give people time to send in things. That's the
one that we sent the postcards out for the last.
set of public hearings. And it would have to be wrapped up by the 26th. That's what I was proposing,
which is the day before Thanksgiving. But that doesn't mean it has to occur that day, just I'm saying
before that time. So the next election board meeting is November 6th and then
two weeks after that is November 20th. I will say these hearings that we had during the last set was
after I think the first one was at five, the second one was at five. It was early evening, yes. I think
if you're right, Molly, it was five or 530, one or the other.
And the email that I got about this, Mr. Achiever said that IC code 3-11-18.3-3E requires that after
the first public hearing, the county election board must wait at least 30 days to hold a second hearing.
During the 30 day period, the board should accept any written comments on the draft vote center plan
that was presented at the first public meeting.
After that 30 day period ends, the county election board can then hold a second hearing to consider
the written public comments filed since the first hearing and hear from others who want to speak at
the second hearing. So that's December. Well, no, we can have the first hearing next week.
have to double check but I think that the first hearing has to be advertised for a certain period of
time and it's greater than the 48 hour like for a regular meeting. If this says the statute does not
provide that any special or advanced notice needs to be given to the public so only the so only the
notice requirement under open door law. I'm not going to be here needs to be observed. Okay I'm not
I'm going to be gone the next two Thursdays so we if you can again. We had. May I suggest. It doesn't
need to be a Thursday. May I suggest.
that since I'm voting in accordance with the direction I'm getting from my chair, that we have my chair
and the opposite party chair get together, maybe with Kylie. We actually have a meeting tomorrow scheduled.
And have a conversation. And rather, again, rather than drag people out for nothing. It's just the two
chairs. Or they're just having just a meeting. It's just nothing fancy, I don't believe. Have a conversation.
And after they have a conversation, then we can revisit this. Also, I have another question. If,
by chance, this was to get passed and vote centers were approved for Monroe County, when are we looking
at implementing them? Because the equipment will not be here for the primary. So one of the things I
heard you say last meeting in early October was that they were switching printers to a brother's printer.
provide new printers with brothers, providing the correct hardware and software, I would think that
they should be able to do that for additional new printers. I mean, you're going from an old system
to a new system. I don't understand why there couldn't be those. It's the actually building the equipment
itself. The manufacturer turnaround time is six to eight months from heart.
because it's a full device. It's not just a printer. It's called a print device. And those are programmed
with all the data inside of it that has every single ballot that we have for Monroe County. And it's
connected to every voter so that when we scan a barcode at early voting, it prints the exact ballot
that individual needs.
So it's not just a computer with a printer. It's an actual print device machine. And if you wanted to,
I could get with our IT specialists and see when we could have a couple of those pulled for you to see
what they look like. You can say something. I was thinking about saying something, but I guess I am.
I think it's fine to do all this.
I had to have Kylie check with heart and see the timeline, but procedurally we're a little ahead of
where we should be because the motion hasn't even been seconded. So we don't know if we're having public
hearings. So I think we have to go back to the underlying motion at hand. Well, there's a motion. There
is not yet a second and I don't want to.
I feel, because we did already have the talk tomorrow with both parties, we as in me, not the rest of
the election board, not an announced or noticed meeting, that I'd rather have that conversation with
both party chairs. And then can we table this motion until the November meeting?
Because it sounds like we wouldn't get it done for the primary that the soonest, if the needle could
be moved at all, the soonest would be in time for the general. I think that you would have to second
it and then make a motion to table it. There hasn't been a second yet. Well, then I'll second and then
make a motion to table. I'll second the motion. Table it until the November meeting.
So I think if there's a second, then there would be a vote on that motion. And if that motion proceeds
or not, after that motion is resolved, you could make a new motion to table. Or alternatively, you could
withdraw your second, the motion would die, and then you could table the conversation. I'm sorry, say
the very last sentence you said.
So alternatively, you could withdraw your second, which means that motion dies. And then we're still
in the conversation, so another board member could propose another motion. So if you withdraw your second,
the motion at hand dies, then you could make another motion, whether it is to table or do something
different. She seconded it, and then she made a motion to table it. So there needs to be a second on
that, and then you vote to table.
She can still withdraw her motion, her second of the initial motion. I'll withdraw my second of the
initial motion. So procedurally, the second has been withdrawn, which means unless someone else is seconding
board member Givens' motion, that motion's going to die. We're still in the conversation. So if another
board member has an alternative motion they would like to propose, then they could do so. So you could
make your motion to table if you'd like.
I'll make a motion to table that. And for clarity, are you tabling it to the November 6th meeting or
to a different date? Because of timing, it'd be better to table it till the December meeting because
I'm going to have a proxy here in November. And I guarantee you they're not going to say anything, not
going to prove anything of this nature. That gives us time to talk to. That gives time for chairpersons
to talk and other people to talk.
Legally, Molly, I promise not in not in fruit. So I believe the motion is to table to December 4th,
which is the date of the December election board meeting. That would be my motion. Yes, second. Those
in any discussion. Those in favor I I opposed I they put it or whatever.
Thank you. We've had a comment on that. So I would entertain a motion to adjourn. Motion to adjourn.
Second. In favor, aye. Aye. Aye. Motion to be adjourned.