WEBVTT 00:00:02.114 --> 00:00:09.177 - meeting of the Monroe County Election Board. It is difficult for us to see if someone's hand is up on 00:00:09.177 --> 00:00:16.241 - the monitors because of their placement. So excuse me we would appreciate it if you would let us know 00:00:16.241 --> 00:00:23.442 - if a hand comes up if someone wants to speak because it's difficult to see that and for future meetings 00:00:23.442 --> 00:00:31.198 - to be really nice to have that back in front of us so we can see it. So I will then call this meeting to order. 00:00:32.290 --> 00:00:41.270 - if I haven't already done that. So we have candidate challenges. So we'll just begin by letting the 00:00:41.270 --> 00:00:50.878 - challenger state their case on the first one, which would be the one for the Clear Creek Township Trustee. 00:01:10.658 --> 00:01:16.300 - Good afternoon, members of the election board. My name is Chrissy Gales and I am the chair of the Monroe 00:01:16.300 --> 00:01:21.726 - County Democratic Party. I'm appearing today on behalf of the party to respectfully request that the 00:01:21.726 --> 00:01:27.099 - board uphold the challenge to the candidate filing submitted by Ms. Thelma Jeffries for Clear Creek 00:01:27.099 --> 00:01:32.741 - Township Trustee. Indiana law requires candidates to submit accurate and complete filing documents under 00:01:32.741 --> 00:01:36.126 - penalty of perjury as a condition for appearing on the ballot. 00:01:36.898 --> 00:01:42.902 - These disclosures exist to ensure transparency and to provide voters and election officials with truthful 00:01:42.902 --> 00:01:48.567 - information about those seeking public office. In their most recent filings, Ms. Jeffries indicated 00:01:48.567 --> 00:01:54.628 - that she has no occupation and no income. Given her role as the incumbent township trustee, this statement 00:01:54.628 --> 00:02:00.406 - raises legitimate questions about whether the filing accurately reflects her current economic status. 00:02:00.406 --> 00:02:06.127 - When required disclosures appear incomplete or unclear, review by this board is both appropriate and 00:02:06.127 --> 00:02:06.750 - necessary. 00:02:07.842 --> 00:02:13.373 - The Office of Township Trustee is one of the most direct and consequential roles in local government. 00:02:13.373 --> 00:02:19.013 - Because this position involves stewardship of public resources and direct service to vulnerable members 00:02:19.013 --> 00:02:24.490 - of our community, transparency and accountability are essential. Clear and accurate disclosures help 00:02:24.490 --> 00:02:28.286 - maintain public trust in those entrusted with these responsibilities. 00:02:29.186 --> 00:02:35.386 - This challenge is neither partisan nor intended to be punitive. It is about ensuring that all candidates 00:02:35.386 --> 00:02:41.291 - are held to the same legal standards and that the integrity of the filing process is preserved. The 00:02:41.291 --> 00:02:47.492 - statutory deadline to amend the Can 12 filing passed at noon on February 13th. At this point, the filing 00:02:47.492 --> 00:02:53.456 - cannot be corrected. The only remaining question before the board is whether the filing was accurate 00:02:53.456 --> 00:02:54.814 - when it was submitted. 00:02:55.618 --> 00:03:00.881 - Given that Ms. Jeffries failed to list her position as the Clear Creek Trustee, which provided her with 00:03:00.881 --> 00:03:06.347 - income in 2025, it is Ms. Jeffries' responsibility to show this election board that she correctly completed 00:03:06.347 --> 00:03:11.509 - her CAN 12. Based on the record before you, the board must either uphold the challenge and remove her 00:03:11.509 --> 00:03:15.710 - name from the ballot, or dismiss the challenge and allow her candidacy to proceed. 00:03:16.514 --> 00:03:27.645 - Public trust in our elections depends on consistent standards, honest disclosures, and equal accountability 00:03:27.645 --> 00:03:38.260 - for every candidate. Upholding this challenge affirms that commitment. Thank you. Ms. Jeffries, do you 00:03:38.260 --> 00:03:39.806 - wish to speak? 00:04:01.378 --> 00:04:13.342 - supposed to sign this in yes I'm Kelly Jeffries trustee at Clear Creek Township okay 00:04:28.578 --> 00:04:40.359 - The first thing I need to do is apologize. And this is a misunderstanding. When I turned in all my forms 00:04:40.359 --> 00:04:51.915 - for reelection, Angie said, well, there's one more that you need to fill out. And so she got that form 00:04:51.915 --> 00:04:53.822 - for me, Form 12. 00:04:54.210 --> 00:05:03.109 - I understood her to say, it doesn't apply to you. You can put N.A. on each line and sign the back of 00:05:03.109 --> 00:05:12.096 - it. And I don't know if she was still at the counter. I think she turned around for a little bit, but 00:05:12.096 --> 00:05:20.995 - she saw me, I'm sure, start with the N.A. on each line. And then I flipped the paper over and signed 00:05:20.995 --> 00:05:23.198 - it and she notarized it. 00:05:24.162 --> 00:05:34.694 - So the only thing I can think of is she probably used the word if, and if it doesn't apply to you, you 00:05:34.694 --> 00:05:40.318 - can put N-A on each line, but I didn't hear that word. 00:05:48.738 --> 00:05:57.175 - to Angie, you are referring to the Angie who works in Election Central? Okay, and you're saying that 00:05:57.175 --> 00:06:05.778 - she directed you to put in A, and because of that you didn't read? No, no, I'm not saying you are, but 00:06:05.778 --> 00:06:13.630 - I'm saying does that mean that you then did not read to know what you were putting in A, too? 00:06:21.090 --> 00:06:36.228 - spouse for 50 years. I didn't think any of it applied to me. So. An employer to mean a job somewhere. 00:06:36.228 --> 00:06:51.070 - Yes. If I I mean if I had read that. I guess legally I'm really not employed. I'm a public servant. 00:06:52.226 --> 00:07:03.150 - have been for 36 years so I'm just I'm just sorry that I didn't I was speaking to another lady that 00:07:03.150 --> 00:07:14.292 - was with me and talking to her about running for the township board and that was Kat Reynolds and she 00:07:14.292 --> 00:07:21.502 - was with me and she did end up running for the township board but 00:07:21.730 --> 00:07:30.687 - All I can say is I'm sorry, and I'm not blaming Angie at all. It's me. So I'm just sorry for not really 00:07:30.687 --> 00:07:34.046 - taking the time and reading all of it. 00:08:12.098 --> 00:08:24.039 - what I've understood the instruction on the on the form. I just want to clarify that in our office we 00:08:24.039 --> 00:08:36.097 - have said that for if it does not apply to you to do put in a so it could have been a miscommunication 00:08:36.097 --> 00:08:41.950 - it could have also been just the miss of one word 00:08:42.274 --> 00:08:52.039 - Um, and then also I wanted to say that there is an individual with their hand up online. Okay. We can't 00:08:52.039 --> 00:09:01.710 - read that. So whoever is, has their hand up online, go ahead. Uh, yes. Hi, this is trying to interact. 00:09:01.710 --> 00:09:11.006 - Randolph. Um, I'm actually only raising my hand because, uh, Ms. Giffins, I think your mic was up. 00:09:11.138 --> 00:09:17.986 - off and I would we online weren't able to hear what you were saying and if it's on there's a technical 00:09:17.986 --> 00:09:24.967 - issue happening. Thank you. I don't know if my mic's working better now but I had it it's working better 00:09:24.967 --> 00:09:31.949 - now. Okay I had asked Miss Jeffries if this was the 10th time that she had filed for office and it would 00:09:31.949 --> 00:09:38.398 - have been the 10th time that she had completed either this form or something very similar to it. 00:09:42.370 --> 00:09:54.671 - I did not realize that an employee from Election Central would be named in this. Is it possible that 00:09:54.671 --> 00:10:07.094 - she has a prepared statement or? I can ask really quickly. Question while you're doing that. Is there 00:10:07.094 --> 00:10:11.966 - a primary challenger for this position? 00:10:29.634 --> 00:10:57.918 - and let Kylie make that reach out to that. As far as the public knowing my salary and everything that's on 00:10:58.594 --> 00:11:09.002 - the annual report that's published every year. So it's not something that was hidden or intended to 00:11:09.002 --> 00:11:19.618 - be hidden. So she did say the same as what I had said. She said in all of the encounters she has said 00:11:19.618 --> 00:11:24.510 - if it does not apply to you, then to put in a. 00:11:27.362 --> 00:11:41.272 - And you're saying you missed the word if. I said if, it doesn't apply to you. Put NA on each line. And 00:11:41.272 --> 00:11:54.911 - I thought she meant, you know, to make sure you put NA on each line that was on there, so I did. But 00:11:54.911 --> 00:11:57.342 - what I heard was, 00:11:57.570 --> 00:12:13.324 - It doesn't apply to you, put N.A. on each line. Yes, go ahead. It does look like she thought she was 00:12:13.324 --> 00:12:26.270 - supposed to put N.A. on every line because then after the N.A. And then the title. 00:12:26.690 --> 00:12:35.097 - Kelly Jeffries on the first line and Clear Creek Township Trustee on the second. Sorry, what? It's on 00:12:35.097 --> 00:12:43.504 - your KN12. It has your name and then it's asked the elected office what you're seeking. And you first 00:12:43.504 --> 00:12:46.718 - put NA on both of the first two lines. 00:12:56.578 --> 00:13:08.402 - I don't know. I don't know. That's not on my copy at all. So somebody else in a clerk's office completed 00:13:08.402 --> 00:13:20.002 - that? Not the clerk's office. Well, it would have been the election. Yeah. That means somebody altered 00:13:20.002 --> 00:13:25.182 - your form. I don't know. We need to ask Angie 00:13:26.530 --> 00:13:33.882 - This is hearsay if it doesn't come directly from Angie. And at this point, I would like for people to 00:13:33.882 --> 00:13:41.235 - be sworn in as they testify. That's what's supposed to happen according to the law. Relax. We can get 00:13:41.235 --> 00:13:48.659 - her here. We can get her here. Ms. Jeffries testify under oath either, which is what I thought the law 00:13:48.659 --> 00:13:51.038 - says is supposed to happen here. 00:14:02.370 --> 00:14:08.713 - Take your time. So you were working. Take your time. Go ahead whenever you're ready. Can you hear me? 00:14:08.713 --> 00:14:15.181 - Oh, there it goes. I think we can fix this issue. I do think in looking at the Election Administrator's 00:14:15.181 --> 00:14:21.524 - Manual the witnesses were supposed to be sworn in and so at this time if the Chair is agreeable I can 00:14:21.524 --> 00:14:27.805 - swear in both Ms. Giles and Ms. Jeffries at the same time and then I'll ask some follow-up questions 00:14:27.805 --> 00:14:28.862 - after that oath. 00:14:31.490 --> 00:14:37.786 - Ms. Jeffries and Ms. Giles, can you raise your right hand please? Do you swear that the testimony that 00:14:37.786 --> 00:14:43.961 - you are going to provide or that you have provided at this meeting is the truth? Okay, so now you've 00:14:43.961 --> 00:14:50.074 - taken the oath and we've kind of done this out of order. You should have taken the oath before your 00:14:50.074 --> 00:14:56.798 - testimony. Does the administration of that oath change in any way the testimony that you've already provided? 00:14:58.050 --> 00:15:06.046 - And I'm going to state for the record that both witnesses have taken the oath and then affirmed that 00:15:06.046 --> 00:15:14.358 - the oath in a way changed their testimony. Thank you. So the question actually turns out to be, is there 00:15:14.358 --> 00:15:22.275 - any law as to who writes down the name on a sheet as long as it's? For me, the issue is when it was 00:15:22.275 --> 00:15:25.758 - written down, if it was written down after. 00:15:26.306 --> 00:15:35.100 - Ms. Jeffries left the office. That is not the way protocol should go. It should have been done before 00:15:35.100 --> 00:15:43.721 - she signed anything. Would you like me to go and have the office closed, the door locked, and bring 00:15:43.721 --> 00:15:48.894 - up the individuals? Is there only one person in the office? 00:15:54.978 --> 00:16:08.926 - process of processing this report. As much as I hate to do that, it probably would be beneficial to 00:16:08.926 --> 00:16:21.758 - have whoever took this form be here. You can do that. Now, go ahead. It looks like it's on. 00:16:30.594 --> 00:16:38.996 - Let me reset these mics. They've got something going on and they're not releasing properly. Do that 00:16:38.996 --> 00:16:47.651 - and we'll let them get the people up here and also get a clarification while that's going on. So we'll 00:16:47.651 --> 00:16:56.054 - be recessed until 1.52. Okay, I have 1.52. I'll call the meeting back to order. I'll be waiting for 00:16:56.054 --> 00:16:57.566 - them to get here. 00:16:57.666 --> 00:17:13.335 - We are going to move on to the second challenge. So Ms. Giles, if you would like to speak to the second 00:17:13.335 --> 00:17:15.294 - one, please. 00:17:15.426 --> 00:17:22.720 - second filing challenge that we were interested in pursuing today is in relation to Miss Dawn Durnall 00:17:22.720 --> 00:17:30.085 - filing for Richland Township Trustee. It would appear that there was no discernible notary seal on the 00:17:30.085 --> 00:17:34.590 - copy of the filing that we received after some discussion with 00:17:34.946 --> 00:17:42.621 - Ms. Ferris, it appears that it's possible that the original filing had a physical seal on it that just 00:17:42.621 --> 00:17:50.073 - did not copy well in the copying procedure. And if that is the case and there is the notary seal on 00:17:50.073 --> 00:17:58.121 - the original filing, then I intend to withdraw my challenge for that filing. I have that copy, the original 00:17:58.121 --> 00:18:03.934 - right here, if you want to come check it. Is that allowed out of your office? 00:18:05.314 --> 00:18:13.966 - the paper? Yes. Yes. Yes. It is evidence. Okay. But I would have thought that Mr. Nell would supply 00:18:13.966 --> 00:18:22.964 - her own evidence. I mean, that satisfies my challenging question. I'm comfortable to withdraw my filing 00:18:22.964 --> 00:18:32.049 - challenge for this one. Thank you. Yes. Thank you. All right. So now we will we will await their arrival 00:18:32.049 --> 00:18:34.558 - and continue. Yes, go ahead. 00:18:34.818 --> 00:18:42.773 - In the meantime, I can answer maybe the question you proposed about the candidate or who fills out this 00:18:42.773 --> 00:18:50.499 - form. Go ahead. Sorry. In looking at the statutes, all the statutes reference the individual running 00:18:50.499 --> 00:18:58.454 - for office. So the section, a candidate for a local office shall file a statement. Another statute says 00:18:58.454 --> 00:18:59.678 - the individual. 00:18:59.778 --> 00:19:06.074 - So it does make it sound like the candidate is the individual who does have to fill out the form. And 00:19:06.074 --> 00:19:12.865 - I also would point out that the form is on the back. There's an affirmation to be completed by the candidate. 00:19:12.865 --> 00:19:19.099 - And so if someone else was filling out the form or added information, the candidate would still have 00:19:19.099 --> 00:19:25.272 - to affirm that the information set forth in the statement is true and complete. And so I think that 00:19:25.272 --> 00:19:29.470 - affirmation is there because the individual filling out the form is 00:19:29.570 --> 00:19:36.946 - supposed to be the candidate. She has signed it. Correct. Signed. And then while I was looking in those 00:19:36.946 --> 00:19:44.393 - code sections, I did want to draw your attention to one other, which has a definition of employer, which 00:19:44.393 --> 00:19:49.854 - I think is pertinent to this question. So according to Indiana statute 3898, 00:19:51.042 --> 00:20:01.176 - A statement must set forth the following information, the name of the employer, the nature of the employer's 00:20:01.176 --> 00:20:10.474 - business. And for purposes of the subdivision, employer means any person from whom the filer or the 00:20:10.474 --> 00:20:19.678 - filer spouse receives more than 33 percent of the filers or the filer spouse's income. Can we ask? 00:20:19.810 --> 00:20:30.467 - question. Absolutely. Absolutely. So Miss Jeffries earlier you said that you didn't view yourself as 00:20:30.467 --> 00:20:41.441 - employed. Do you get a W-2 from the Clear Creek Township Trust and a W-2 is only issued by an employer, 00:20:41.441 --> 00:20:48.510 - correct? Right. It was, it's an old law and I had it written down. 00:20:50.690 --> 00:21:03.118 - An elected official is not an employee. It is tax-wise. Labor-wise, it's not. Ms. Turner-King, could 00:21:03.118 --> 00:21:17.022 - you verify what was just said? Ms. Jeffries indicated that there's an old law, but I don't know if it's current. 00:21:17.826 --> 00:21:26.379 - indicating that an elected official is not an employee? I can. It might take me a minute to try to figure 00:21:26.379 --> 00:21:34.933 - out where that might be. Federal. It's federal. Does that only apply to federal employees then? Federally 00:21:34.933 --> 00:21:43.083 - elected officials, does it apply to? It didn't say federal employees. I can start digging in federal 00:21:43.083 --> 00:21:47.198 - code, but I don't know how quickly I'll find that. 00:21:49.058 --> 00:22:01.813 - The whole thing boils around whether or not that classifies as an employer or not by law. So that's 00:22:01.813 --> 00:22:08.318 - why we need to have an answer to that when we can. 00:22:39.746 --> 00:22:44.850 - What's the disadvantage to having election central in the new building versus the old building? It's 00:22:44.850 --> 00:22:46.366 - not a two-block walk anymore. 00:23:51.490 --> 00:23:58.627 - So I did locate in federal code in the equal employment opportunity section and within the definition 00:23:58.627 --> 00:24:05.623 - section it does state the term employee means an individual employed by an employer except the term 00:24:05.623 --> 00:24:12.690 - employee shall not include any person elected to public office in any state or political subdivision 00:24:12.690 --> 00:24:20.036 - of any state by the qualified voters thereof or any person chosen by such officer to be on such officers 00:24:20.036 --> 00:24:21.086 - personal staff 00:24:21.218 --> 00:24:27.815 - or an appointee on the policymaking level, or an immediate advisor. And then it lists a whole bunch 00:24:27.815 --> 00:24:34.412 - of other, but I think the question's answered. However, that's in the civil rights equal employment 00:24:34.412 --> 00:24:41.010 - opportunity section of federal code. And I'm not sure, without some further research, how that code 00:24:41.010 --> 00:24:44.638 - section interplays with what is in Indiana state code. 00:24:46.690 --> 00:24:55.792 - because the code section itself pertaining to CAN 12 defines employer in a way that I do think includes 00:24:55.792 --> 00:25:04.631 - public official if indeed the income for which Ms. Jeffries receives as trustee accommodates for 33% 00:25:04.631 --> 00:25:13.470 - of her income. Well, the question, though, sounds like does federal law supersede state law in this? 00:25:15.714 --> 00:25:22.639 - Typically it does, yes. But it's not in a code section that I would normally expect to find it. It's 00:25:22.639 --> 00:25:29.700 - just in the definition section of that equal employment opportunity. Thank you. Ms. Jeffries, you have 00:25:29.700 --> 00:25:36.831 - someone who's come to sit beside you with that. Is that moral support or does she wish to add something 00:25:36.831 --> 00:25:42.110 - to the? Both. She was with me. When you filled it out? When I filled it out. 00:25:42.210 --> 00:25:55.966 - I think that would be some interesting information to have added to this. 00:26:11.170 --> 00:26:18.183 - and nothing is on there. And it doesn't have the name up on the top. Yeah, they just got here. Okay. 00:26:18.183 --> 00:26:25.404 - Ms. Ferris, would you have your employees? Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. Go ahead. Could we have this read 00:26:25.404 --> 00:26:32.625 - into the record that the statement that copy that Ms. Jeffries just shared with us does not have either 00:26:32.625 --> 00:26:37.694 - her name or the position she was seeking on the copy that she was given? 00:26:42.306 --> 00:26:51.145 - Go ahead. I was going to say both Kelsey Rubio and Angela Flick are both here. They are both the full-time 00:26:51.145 --> 00:26:59.489 - individuals from the office. On this, I also want to state in the past with my predecessor, if there 00:26:59.489 --> 00:27:07.998 - was an amendment that needed to be changed, you would make that and then put your initials next to it. 00:27:08.290 --> 00:27:16.171 - let Clerk Brown know about this also, and I noticed that the initials are missing on this one. And when 00:27:16.171 --> 00:27:23.900 - looking back at this document, I realized that this is the one that we had with Kelsey. She had asked 00:27:23.900 --> 00:27:31.477 - me about this, and it was connected to her filing, had her signature on the back, so we knew it had 00:27:31.477 --> 00:27:37.918 - connected to her. Yeah. That there was an omission of the initials by the person who 00:27:39.330 --> 00:27:51.757 - completed the candidate who had made the amendment yes made the amendment to the paper so what do you 00:27:51.757 --> 00:28:04.915 - what do we need to do there well I think um I'm not sure it was miss Jeffries indicating that miss Reynolds 00:28:04.915 --> 00:28:07.230 - would be providing 00:28:07.906 --> 00:28:14.983 - Additional statements or as both parties presented their case and you're now deliberating like I don't 00:28:14.983 --> 00:28:21.373 - know where we are in the hearing If you have something to add to this it would be this would 00:28:21.373 --> 00:28:28.450 - be an appropriate time I think I would have to administer an oath first. Thank you. Please do. Can you 00:28:28.450 --> 00:28:33.054 - please raise your hand? Oh You're right one Can you say your name? 00:28:35.778 --> 00:28:43.800 - Ms. Reynolds, do you swear or affirm that the information you're about to provide to the election board 00:28:43.800 --> 00:28:51.668 - will be true and accurate? Yes, ma'am. For the record, Ms. Reynolds has taken the oath. Oh, go ahead. 00:28:51.668 --> 00:28:59.767 - If you have something to add to her. I heard pretty much the same thing Thelma stated. And when I filled 00:28:59.767 --> 00:29:04.318 - mine out, I took it to mean, was there a conflict of jobs? 00:29:06.498 --> 00:29:17.763 - With Elma filled that out, she saw that part. I think she was seeing no, there was no conflict of her 00:29:17.763 --> 00:29:29.248 - being trustee or anything on that part. It was an honest to God mistake in my mind. Thank you. Welcome. 00:29:29.248 --> 00:29:31.678 - Are you reading code? 00:29:32.482 --> 00:29:42.587 - I reached out to both of the attorneys at the Indiana election division and this is about the employer 00:29:42.587 --> 00:29:52.693 - and the statement must set forth the following information for the preceding calendar year so it would 00:29:52.693 --> 00:29:57.598 - be a year before or 2025 since she filed in 2026. 00:29:59.458 --> 00:30:07.990 - name of the employer, the nature of the employer's business. For this subdivision, the employer means 00:30:07.990 --> 00:30:16.689 - any person from whom the filer or the filer spouse received the income. And that's what we were talking 00:30:16.689 --> 00:30:25.221 - about earlier. I was trying to ascertain whether it could be misconstrued as outside employment since 00:30:25.221 --> 00:30:28.734 - they're asking about your spouse as well. 00:30:33.218 --> 00:30:41.409 - I had also reached out to Matt, the attorney, the Democratic attorney. I have a copy of his email back 00:30:41.409 --> 00:30:49.361 - to me that I'd be happy to share. This is dated February the 4th, 2026 at 4.30 p.m. and he said the 00:30:49.361 --> 00:30:57.314 - CAN 12 defines what an employer is and then he said at the end, he said, if an elected official who 00:30:57.314 --> 00:31:00.574 - is filed for reelection or filed to run, 00:31:00.770 --> 00:31:10.730 - for another office received more than 33% of their income in 2025 from the salary for the elected office. 00:31:10.730 --> 00:31:20.502 - Then he assumes that meets the definition of an employer. And the other attorney indicates in a message 00:31:20.502 --> 00:31:30.462 - to me that it may vary depending upon the facts. And Miss Jeffries, I'm trying to just ascertain what you 00:31:31.618 --> 00:31:41.707 - what you thought you were responding to when you put not applicable on your employer. Does that make 00:31:41.707 --> 00:31:51.795 - sense? In a way, yes. When you reached out and put not applicable, did you see the part where it was 00:31:51.795 --> 00:31:56.190 - asking you for the name of an employer? No. 00:32:12.674 --> 00:32:23.345 - legal counsel a question? Sure, go ahead. It is my understanding that the people in the election office 00:32:23.345 --> 00:32:33.708 - are not to serve as the police, but they're also not the people that are legally required to provide 00:32:33.708 --> 00:32:39.454 - information about what goes on a form. Is that correct? 00:32:45.090 --> 00:32:55.305 - my response is that the person legally required to provide what is on the form is the person affirming 00:32:55.305 --> 00:33:05.817 - to it, which would be the candidate. Thank you. So we waited for the ladies to come from Election Center. 00:33:05.817 --> 00:33:08.990 - Do we have something from them? 00:33:09.346 --> 00:33:16.051 - if you want to bring them onto the record also. But like I said, going back, looking at this, I realized 00:33:16.051 --> 00:33:22.627 - that this was one of the situations that we had handled in the office and then clarified that with you 00:33:22.627 --> 00:33:29.204 - guys. If you guys want to ask more questions, I mean, it's completely up to them. I asked them to make 00:33:29.204 --> 00:33:35.717 - themselves available to this meeting if you had any questions for them. Yeah, why don't we swear them 00:33:35.717 --> 00:33:38.910 - in in case somebody wants to ask them a question? 00:33:40.290 --> 00:33:48.481 - Hello, can you both please raise your right hand? Can you state your name, please? Ms. Rubio and Ms. 00:33:48.481 --> 00:33:56.753 - Flick, do you swear or affirm the information you're about to provide the election board will be true 00:33:56.753 --> 00:34:05.025 - and accurate? Please let the record reflect. Both witnesses took the oath. So a question I would have 00:34:05.025 --> 00:34:09.566 - is, does one of you remember working with her paperwork 00:34:10.562 --> 00:34:23.686 - I'm sure you had, you both did. If I may chair, it might be beneficial if they move to a mic so that 00:34:23.686 --> 00:34:37.070 - the recording picks us up. I need to sign. After it wouldn't hurt. I would like to add just one thing. 00:34:37.070 --> 00:34:40.318 - My packet to turn in the 00:34:41.218 --> 00:34:49.551 - registration forms and everything. We got off the internet and it didn't print the form 12. That's why 00:34:49.551 --> 00:34:58.046 - I didn't have it when I turned it all in. Thank you. What I'm after from you two is, do you recall about 00:34:58.046 --> 00:35:06.136 - the name being put on when it would, if you remember, just enlighten us, please. I asked Kylie when 00:35:06.136 --> 00:35:09.534 - I was scanning the forms in the next day, 00:35:10.690 --> 00:35:18.141 - process them to add to the county website the day after they filed. So she wasn't in the office anymore 00:35:18.141 --> 00:35:25.306 - when we realized her name was not on it. I asked Kylie if I should add it, and she told me yes, and 00:35:25.306 --> 00:35:32.614 - I just forgot to initial that I added her name in office. So that was your writing for her name? Yes, 00:35:32.614 --> 00:35:40.638 - that's my handwriting. And the precedent had been that if the candidate had left and some information needed to 00:35:42.210 --> 00:35:54.082 - clarifying information to identify the candidate for whom the form belonged that you would add that 00:35:54.082 --> 00:36:06.666 - name and the office you didn't you didn't respond to anything else and and you just neglected to initial. 00:36:06.666 --> 00:36:09.278 - That is correct. Yes. 00:36:09.474 --> 00:36:15.227 - Oh, I'm sorry, Kyle, if you start to say something, go ahead. No, you're fine. I was going to say, also, 00:36:15.227 --> 00:36:20.761 - moving forward, we could set a policy with the election board on this, since this was something from 00:36:20.761 --> 00:36:26.295 - the predecessor of my position. Just that way, we have better clarification. Everybody's on the same 00:36:26.295 --> 00:36:31.993 - board. Then we probably would be good to have a checklist of things to look at before someone who files 00:36:31.993 --> 00:36:37.472 - leaves the office. I mean, which of us hasn't needed a checklist at some point in time in our life? 00:36:37.472 --> 00:36:39.390 - I was looking at something earlier 00:36:39.490 --> 00:36:51.246 - and now I can't remember where I saw it, but it was about whether or not it rendered someone ineligible 00:36:51.246 --> 00:37:03.001 - for the office. You know, and we had the last challenge that we had and the last challenge that we had, 00:37:03.001 --> 00:37:08.766 - the defense was that the candidate made a mistake. 00:37:12.066 --> 00:37:22.848 - that was otherwise eligible to run for that office. So that's where I am in terms of. So there's precedent 00:37:22.848 --> 00:37:33.328 - that someone made a mistake. There's a precedent that even though they may have signed saying, I affirm 00:37:33.328 --> 00:37:38.366 - under penalty of perjury that everything is true, 00:37:40.130 --> 00:37:47.636 - was a different person in your chair if the person did not understand what they were signing and or 00:37:47.636 --> 00:37:55.517 - had made some kind of mistake that that did not disqualify them from being a valid candidate for office. 00:37:55.517 --> 00:38:03.023 - So it still, it seems to me that still the question boils down to the disagreement or the disparity 00:38:03.023 --> 00:38:09.854 - in state and federal law as to whether or not this is considered to be an employer or not. 00:38:14.338 --> 00:38:23.432 - Okay, the other attorneys that board member Githin spoke to said it is unclear if an inaccurate, 00:38:23.432 --> 00:38:32.995 - I'm sorry, please excuse me. It is also it is unclear if an inaccurate but timely filed candidate can 00:38:32.995 --> 00:38:42.745 - form his grounds for upholding a challenge because he's not seen that before. So you're making history, 00:38:42.745 --> 00:38:43.870 - Ms. Thelma. 00:38:47.362 --> 00:39:02.877 - I'm in a situation like this to, if it's unclear, to let voters make decisions. So I'm going to kind 00:39:02.877 --> 00:39:15.166 - of go a little bit with the old business comment, and if we have someone in the 00:39:15.810 --> 00:39:29.323 - audience that would like to make a comment on this would like to comment I would be willing to take 00:39:29.323 --> 00:39:43.646 - that. Sure Langdon I've worked at the election central I've done their jobs. It is so easy for and not to 00:39:43.970 --> 00:39:52.213 - anything and any disparage for them. To make mistakes themselves. Training is not always the best. And 00:39:52.213 --> 00:40:00.377 - I experienced that myself, especially when these girls are unfamiliar with the forms and they've only 00:40:00.377 --> 00:40:08.540 - done so many elections. And same goes with the candidates. They fill out the forms but they come back 00:40:08.540 --> 00:40:13.342 - and if they're not doing this every day, that muscle memory 00:40:13.826 --> 00:40:23.656 - It's just not there. So I see no problems with the voters being able to make that decision, whether 00:40:23.656 --> 00:40:33.583 - or not she is, you know, qualified for the job and let it be up to the voters. Thank you. Thank you. 00:40:33.583 --> 00:40:43.806 - Anyone else? Well, then I think we probably, we don't have time before you print the primary ballots to 00:40:45.250 --> 00:40:52.636 - get more of a clarification than what we already have. Is that correct? Deadline is noon on Thursday. 00:40:52.636 --> 00:41:00.312 - The deadline would be noon on Thursday. I think if you would have to notice a meeting with 48-hour notice 00:41:00.312 --> 00:41:07.626 - according under open door unless you recessed, you could recess and state a later date and time now. 00:41:07.626 --> 00:41:15.230 - So I mean, you could recess to tomorrow or sometime between noon on Thursday. I'm just looking for what? 00:41:15.746 --> 00:41:35.009 - is out there. I think it's important that voters know what's going on. And basically, Ms. Jeffries 00:41:35.009 --> 00:41:42.014 - unfortunately did not pay attention 00:41:43.490 --> 00:41:50.902 - That's important for an elected official in her position because she is the front line for folks in 00:41:50.902 --> 00:41:58.760 - Clear Creek Township. And I'm also a bit upset that things are happening like that in the clerk's office. 00:41:58.760 --> 00:42:06.172 - I think it's the candidate's responsibility to know what form they're to fill out. I think it's the 00:42:06.172 --> 00:42:13.214 - candidate's responsibility to fill it out correctly. And this isn't just a simple situation of 00:42:13.570 --> 00:42:21.119 - not understanding that she should have or should not have filled out this stuff about an employer, she 00:42:21.119 --> 00:42:28.595 - didn't even read the form well enough to say the name of the person seeking the office and the office 00:42:28.595 --> 00:42:35.998 - to which she was elected. Those clearly are important parts of stuff. And to me, I at least want the 00:42:35.998 --> 00:42:42.814 - voters to be aware of this. I think that that is fair to the voters in Clear Creek Township. 00:42:45.314 --> 00:42:54.864 - And so with Mr. Kochivar saying it is unclear and there does not appear to be a precedent for an inaccurate, 00:42:54.864 --> 00:43:03.625 - which is where we are, it's inaccurate, but timely filed form is grounds for upholding a challenge. 00:43:03.625 --> 00:43:12.474 - And so if there is no precedent, then as you say, then we could leave it to the voter. It's not like 00:43:12.474 --> 00:43:15.102 - this is not a public hearing. 00:43:15.522 --> 00:43:24.582 - I'm inclined to let the voters make the decisions as opposed to. So I think at this point in time, we 00:43:24.582 --> 00:43:32.931 - may be ready just to take the question. So go ahead. If you're asking for a motion. Go ahead. 00:43:32.931 --> 00:43:42.258 - I kind of am. My motion would be that because it is an inaccurate but timely filed, it was timely filed. 00:43:42.258 --> 00:43:45.278 - Inaccurate but timely filed form. 00:43:46.594 --> 00:43:57.931 - that we dismiss the challenge. That's a motion, so I'll make a second so we can get a vote. Would you 00:43:57.931 --> 00:44:09.934 - call the roll? Let's just do this. Clerk Brown? That's clear. The motion is to deny the challenge, correct? 00:44:09.934 --> 00:44:16.158 - Yes. So I vote yes on denying the challenge. I'm sorry. 00:44:16.418 --> 00:44:26.441 - I'm too many things thinking. Call the roll. Call the roll. Okay. Clerk Brown. Yes. Danny Shields. Yes. 00:44:26.441 --> 00:44:36.368 - No. Motion passes. The challenge is denied. Have any other business that we need to deal with? I don't 00:44:36.368 --> 00:44:40.030 - think we have anything on the agenda. 00:44:41.922 --> 00:44:48.312 - There's nothing else on this agenda, mainly just wanted to make sure that this was focused solely on 00:44:48.312 --> 00:44:54.639 - the hearing, and then the rest will be on next week's agenda for the actual election board meeting. 00:44:54.639 --> 00:45:00.966 - Thank you. She withdrew the other challenge. Oh, she withdrew, sorry. Yeah, the other challenge was 00:45:00.966 --> 00:45:07.293 - withdrawn, yes. You're right, sir. So I would like to keep public comment to this if we can. If you 00:45:07.293 --> 00:45:09.950 - have something about this, it'd be great. 00:45:11.426 --> 00:45:20.058 - It'd be nice to move up. Go ahead. Go ahead. Again, my name is Cheryl Langdon. This is from a Ronald 00:45:20.058 --> 00:45:27.921 - Reagan speech from the eighties about Joe Biden. The man who sounded like the world was Mr. 00:45:27.921 --> 00:45:36.382 - Rogers neighborhood was suddenly discovered that America has some dangerous adversaries out there. 00:45:36.514 --> 00:45:44.305 - The man in all his years in the Senate voted against every weapon except slingshots and is now talking 00:45:44.305 --> 00:45:51.945 - tough about our adversaries and the need for national security. I'm going to pause here and let that 00:45:51.945 --> 00:45:59.736 - marinate. So the traitor who left our borders wide open for four years flip-flopped so many times back 00:45:59.736 --> 00:46:06.014 - in the 80s and 90s that you would have thought he was on fire. Oh, he was on fire. 00:46:06.210 --> 00:46:13.506 - Liar, liar, pants on fire. Democrats need to admit that they were wrong about Joe Biden, a traitor to 00:46:13.506 --> 00:46:21.017 - our sovereign nation. I will continue. In the audience, someone yells, he doesn't know what he's talking 00:46:21.017 --> 00:46:28.314 - about. And Reagan replies, you're right, he doesn't. And last minute conversions aren't going to hide 00:46:28.314 --> 00:46:35.038 - the fact that these liberal Democrats don't represent traditional Democrats anymore, unquote. 00:46:35.266 --> 00:46:42.004 - What did Reagan mean by that? It's easy to see now that we are on the other side of everything, including 00:46:42.004 --> 00:46:48.551 - our witnessing Dick Cheney's open hate for Trump. There's been a deeper deception in both parties, and 00:46:48.551 --> 00:46:54.970 - Americans have come together to make a statement about any traitors in our ranks. We see you. When a 00:46:54.970 --> 00:47:01.517 - president has left our borders vulnerable and allowed our national security to fail for the first time 00:47:01.517 --> 00:47:03.742 - in US history, the guy named Trump 00:47:03.906 --> 00:47:11.032 - who wants to bring national security back is openly hated by the big weapons czar, Dick Cheney, something's 00:47:11.032 --> 00:47:18.157 - fishy. Conservatives in every corner around the world are waking up. This has nothing to do with acceptance 00:47:18.157 --> 00:47:24.953 - of countercultures, but rather exploitation of counterculture to infiltrate the sanctity of the family 00:47:24.953 --> 00:47:27.262 - system, the core of every society. 00:47:27.586 --> 00:47:33.750 - It's time to get our facts straight, our loyalties to our sovereign nation on point, and our civility 00:47:33.750 --> 00:47:40.095 - to partner with our courage. I didn't vote for Reagan in the 80s because I was protesting in the streets 00:47:40.095 --> 00:47:46.259 - to bring AIDS to the forefront because my friends were dying. And people like Fauci were perpetrating 00:47:46.259 --> 00:47:52.422 - misinformation in the 80s and creating fear. Yeah, that guy. You see, I've been fighting against that 00:47:52.422 --> 00:47:56.894 - monster for a long time. I've also been through the LA riots. I lived it. 00:47:57.026 --> 00:48:03.466 - And the extreme conflict between the right and the left is so dysfunctional that those of us who have 00:48:03.466 --> 00:48:09.907 - been in the trenches of humanity for over a half century just want what Rodney King wanted. Why can't 00:48:09.907 --> 00:48:16.284 - we all just get along? Well, Rodney, we can't when there are nefarious bad actors who are willing to 00:48:16.284 --> 00:48:22.598 - create chaos rather than cultivate civility. What happened to go high, Mr. Obama? Oh, that's right. 00:48:22.598 --> 00:48:25.566 - Your team lied and they keep lying. Know what? 00:48:25.698 --> 00:48:35.097 - The most terrifying part is the fact that our real enemies are in our own government. Thank you. I second 00:48:35.097 --> 00:48:42.014 - those in favor. Aye. Opposed. We're adjourned and we'll be back in two weeks.