- Good evening everyone. I'll call to order the April administrative meeting of
- the planning commission. Tammy, would you call the roll to get started?
- Let's see. We have
- uh all right Dave Bush. Here. David Henry. I'm here. Um, Edward Olme. There's Jeff Morris.
- Here. Um, Gregory Clements. Here. Julie Thomas. Here. Here. Scott Barracks. Here. And trying
- to find right right now is absent. So we have seven people that is in person quorum. Thank you. So
- under administrative business, the first item is the CEO prioritization list. So can you give
- any updates on that this month? We don't really. Um, I think some of the things are embedded in
- the packet for more along the lines of some track changes identified by staff. And you're going to
- see also a little bit of a landscape chapter amendment. And we're working on impervious cover.
- So we haven't changed anything in here yet, but you'll be introduced to it tonight. So all right.
- It sounds good. The second item under administrative business is a CDO map error
- at 3,800 west constitution. I somehow, um, we had in 2022 rezoned, um, a cook property on liberty
- drive or no constitution of constitution drives out of a PUD and had made it light industrial.
- That was even mine. Um, and we just, someone had called in for an appraisal or something. And
- we realized it was an error in that just didn't get switched or something with the CDO. So we're
- just going to take that. I think to the, I'll take it to you guys. I think next to standard
- work session, get that amendment. Okay. Okay. Thanks for being on that team.
- So moving on to unfinished business, we have, uh, SIA-22-7, how long do you think it's?
- Yeah, there's the two of them together. And it's also SIA-22-9. Um,
- you all heard this at the regular session, um, last month. And I included in the packet,
- kind of a summary from what was discussed. And since then, we have not heard a keep from
- the developer. Uh, we will, I'll be checking back in with them, you know, this next week to see if
- I need to update the packet or the report. But I have no updates on this one. Does anyone have
- any questions on how it feels? I think I don't have any. I just have a couple. Uh,
- and I brought this up at the last meeting. There are some things that can be approved by the plan
- commission and some things that, some things that do not require the commissioners to approve.
- This is one of those things that's approved by the plan commission. Correct. It would be very
- helpful, particularly for some of us who are, don't understand the what levels yet, if you would
- put
- it right there in the beginning of the packet. You know, like you say, this goes to the commissioners
- for approval, or you can just say, this is for plan commission approval. I can see that. Like a
- sentence, just a sentence. There's really only like two things. It will be, well, yeah, I hear
- your point. Yeah. Rezones, text amendments. So in the petition, you're saying the beginning of the
- petition. I don't care where it is, but it should just be right up front. That's the sentence or
- half a sentence to say. Because there's a list in the petition about where things have gone
- and where they're going. We do have a little box in our rules procedure that might actually be in
- the CDO now. It kind of says where things end up. But in petitions themselves, you often will see
- where this event, like if it's been for an interview. So you could say in the future,
- okay, added there, right? Sure. On this chart, you know, in the box, we added by authority
- there. And if it's planned commission, it could be planned commission. If it's commissioners,
- it can be commissioners. Yeah, final authority. I think it was pretty common in the past to have
- it in the first sentence where it either said approval or recommendation. I haven't seen it
- so much. And these reports, we didn't ever do these really before, other than it was a reduction.
- And I think, Jeff, too, what you're thinking about too is I know at Platte, almost all of
- our packets always have, because the Platte, it's like a 50/50 on stuff that gets approved,
- that gets a motion of approval or motion of recommendation. And so they even just having,
- you know, add one more cell to your little spreadsheet shape. Okay. You know, where it
- just says, it's a recommendation versus a final. So what's obvious to you is not necessarily
- obvious
- to some of us. Any other questions for Tammy on Holland Fields? Okay, moving on to new business,
- we have business and accounting development. So this is a text amendment that we identified
- working through impervious cover.
- Last month we did at the Board of Zoning and Appeals several variances for impervious cover.
- This month we have like another seven of them ready to go. We are wanting to do a text amendment
- to sort of change the standard. We've reached out to the drainage board, then we worked with the
- stormwater program manager and Jackie and I put together a text amendment. And it looks a little
- bit like this. So in each residentially zoned two pager, other than HD, we did not use this for
- identity. It's already such a small lot. But on the second page of those two pagers, we have
- amended the subscript number two, and it says CD chapter 813 for exceptions. And this is associated
- with both maximum impervious cover and maximum impervious cover for development within a critical
- watershed. So there are two standards. These each have a secondary subscript and scrolling
- through all the pages when it's coming up, getting to chapter 813. All right. So what we have is
- this
- is the text that we're proposing. It is basically smoothing driveways. There's page 48 of their
- first
- packet. So this is something that you might want to read through. And we also have included
- one figure here to describe the parking space would work and also kind of another way of how we
- would
- be calculating impervious cover. Everything like outlined in yellow, including this little circle
- drives, swingable parking lot, those all get counted. What doesn't get counted is the driveway
- to access the house. And then some of the details they bear were like, we're not going to count
- driveways specifically if they're going through non-governable areas. So right of way, setbacks,
- flagpole lots, if it's an easement, like if you have an easement running through your property,
- we're not going to count that against you. Because we just, it's not sustainable for staff to keep
- bringing all of these impervious variances. Most of them are getting, well, I can't say most are
- getting approved yet, but it's, we're not trying to not have variances for every single petition,
- like every single review. We do see that there might be structures or more compact development
- that could be encouraged. The driveways on the report that we had for the ORC seemed to be a
- problem. So that's what this one is. Does anyone have any questions? Yes.
- I don't understand the significance, so maybe I should ask March 11, 2014, what is the significance
- of that date? That's when we had our last set of aerials that we can prove it.
- So that's where our aerials are. So if somebody asked you that question. I can look and see
- visually if you have an existing driveway. There might be a couple that we missed and you can
- maybe petition that. But is there something, is that why it's a magical date?
- That's when our last aerials were run. I think our aerials might have gone through just in 2025,
- already this year. I don't have a published date. But I don't think the flyover has happened yet
- this year. Or if it did, it happened like last week or two weeks ago. But we were getting
- inquiries about the weather. It feels like we've been getting, we've had aerials
- through every year, even on contracts. So these were last year's aerials, basically, in 2024.
- I actually mentioned if we should try to use 2025 and preemptively see
- John Baten knows when those happen. I see what you're saying.
- We don't know what the quality of those are going to be. One year, I remember,
- we had terrible quality ones that weren't right. I don't think they are, and so we'll look at this.
- Yeah, yeah. Okay. And that's a good set. Okay.
- Thank you, Jamie. So moving on to the second item, the urban sliding
- scale subdivision preliminary utilities and street tree waiver.
- So the urban subdivision, it's one lot here that's turning into a few lots.
- They are requesting a utility waiver for this existing line. There was some robust
- session at the Black Committee last week. It was just last Thursday. So this packet was published
- and then Black Committee happened. This report's going to get updated with the Black Committee
- finding their recommendation, I think was a no recommendation. And then this one also ran into
- a street tree waiver. Yeah, so they're doing, they're asking for a street tree waiver.
- I will tell you that both of the subdivisions that you're kind of getting introduced to tonight
- were guinea pigs for our new work, you know, CDO. And we did identify that we have some text that
- we're needing to correct in street trees for subdivisions. And you'll see that here just a
- little bit tonight. This is what the plat looks like. It's a new plot. A lot of you were at that
- black committee. It's a big, it's a bigger group now. So we can get a report on why they said no
- recommendation, just like we see with the RIC or whatever. Okay. Yeah. There will be a little
- paragraph in the staff report. This is like what was going on. And I think a recommendation will
- be updated in time for the regular session. Yeah. Okay. Perfect. Thank you.
- Okay. Moving on to the third item, the five-place sliding scale subdivision,
- preliminary flat root replay current. Great. So that did these two lots here
- and they're wanting it to be three lots. This one
- has, this one is also getting a little bit dinged for those street trees.
- It is unclear yet. We're still doing some information gathering. Again,
- the flat committee was just on Thursday. So we're trying to like get more information about their
- street trees. If they can count this like row down here, if they're outside the right of way.
- And then it looks like maybe five trees might be required here. I'm not sure if they're going to
- be requesting a street tree waiver yet or not. I'll have that updated by the next packet. And then
- they also had a load with labor. This is what the flat looks like. We did have a very robust
- discussion again about access to lot one. Yeah, because the driveway is here and it will have to
- skirt around the sinkhole. This is 21 feet. Staff had made a recommendation but it should
- be a shared driveway. Staff packet, I'm not sure if it's changing yet or not. We're still
- information gathering on some things. That was all I had to say on that one. Oh, and there will be
- a
- correction to the traffic count. So this is something new. When we have a road with labor,
- they're needing to do their average daily count and submit that to us to see if it
- qualifies for the waiver. In which case it looks like this one's going to but
- there's an error and that's when it will be updated. Any questions for staff on this one?
- We're moving on to the fourth item, North Park PUD outline plan, amendment six.
- So this is amendment number six to the entirety of the North Park PUD. This would include 46
- partials at a total of 470 acres spanning multiple sections including Township and Richland Township.
- This does a mass overhaul of the north park PUD which does the creation of new districts
- one of which would allow one of which would be the government center that would allow
- a new Monroe County justice facility. Does anybody have any questions on this one?
- Moving right along the back. Yeah also maybe I'm not sure if we can take these three high
- ones together. Absolutely put them together but I've had to do some reports.
- There's going to be updates to these reports basically
- four county staff members five county staff members met on site at Highland Park Estates this
- morning.
- Did a full walkthrough. We're kind of reviewing their as-built. The outcome of that meeting is
- that basically they're going to do their darnedest to make corrections out there by August 20th of
- this summer and hopefully like be able to get some acceptance. It's going to take a lot of work
- with
- the neighbors out there because of driveway corrections but yeah a lot of the highway
- department out there they support the efforts what's happening. I don't know if I have any other
- main
- highlights to this. We had seen it they had been introduced to it back in January
- but it's real. You guys are introduced to it back in January and then we we did approve
- our own practice dates phase five which had a condition of approval and which I have in
- our report and there is just favorite implement that eventually talking about when these get
- completed. So we're bringing this back again for performance period extension date which
- is looking like it'll be August 25th 2025.
- Thank you Ms. Christian. Hey if not can we take items keep an eye on the Freeman
- field subdivision? Okay well so Freeman fields um I don't think anything happened
- and the transfer of ownership out here looks like we're going to see some movement on getting this
- one completed um and looking like they're going to be doing that in 2030. This is Jackie's report
- it has got a lot of details in it you might want to read it um I think it was in the newspaper
- recently as well so this just um let me carry on is this the one by uh people yes the point
- yeah yeah off the Strain Bridge it's exciting yes Barry. It's been there for a long time
- yeah it's been running it's got well did you see the price point right on the homes
- yeah that can be affordable. I think it's um it's are there flooding concerns there are there any
- it's high and dry um we're not sure like what their detention basements look like
- oh those people as built might need correction okay got it because I imagine that something drawn
- up
- that month ago so okay that and our records are fully okay like got it it's there's a there's a
- whole lot of back history and a lot of back history you're gonna be a problem with the
- the uh line of credit no I think they put up a bump or whatever they put up it's not gonna be a
- problem no they reposted I think it's good they're yeah I'm just really wanting to make this bill
- oh for sure for sure yeah um and then I made a cheat sheet for the last thing from tonight
- more people here than myself so if you haven't asked that um let me open up part number two yeah
- all right we'll figure out we'll share one
- this is a new CD oh god you guys are gonna be full of like 500 page documents you felt the reading
- so it's gonna throw like so these I identified all of these are what I feel like are the highlights
- of you're gonna see a lot of little like that's right like it's all little corrections throughout
- the CDO a lot of it is just where our consultants made links to those things and that made it look
- a little sloppy um something um and I will also say that we're gonna try to in the next packet
- when you see this part two I'm hoping that we have the CDO numbering matching the packet numbering
- right now they're like four pages off which was totally annoying so when you're if you're wanting
- to get a preview of all these texts amendments um look at the CDO document number not the PDF
- number but I'm going to try to get those linked up for the next packet um page
- oh is it going to tell me 11 or 15 is is is this going to be loaded as a
- document under the CDO website um that would be easiest thing is it if like a red line version
- of this yes I mean this is the red line version right of the data dropped into the CDO
- yeah website then
- I don't envy us all I know this is a lot difficult and yeah push comes to shove these little timing
- yes um you know alignments throughout they can pay for it so then it so we so we this had been
- in there at one point and then it was gone and added it back in so that anytime we make a revision
- we can have a quick reference of what chapters were impacted so this is coming back um
- added links on page 19 the two pagers look like a lot is is happening and they're um
- Jackie worked really hard on the two pagers because a lot of our way our ordinance works that if we
- have the main use table and our ordinance says that that's what rings true and that's what we
- would use if there's a discrepancy we use the big use table um we were finding some discrepancies
- in our two pagers so we this is cleaning up the two pagers to make it correspond to the use table
- and then we also had again some of the like subscript those little superscript number
- superscript numbers yes um we're not aligning something happened and a lot got jogged jogged
- around so that's what's going on with the two pagers but it's always great to have a second
- set of eyes there so your eyes all your eyes okay can i interject real quick tamer you've had that
- um that if there's a mistake that um the overarching document the large scale one
- is the dominant thing that you go by not the two pagers the big use table big use table yeah yes
- the use is that documented somewhere yes it is it is codified codified it's codified in here okay
- that's that's why i'm asking just because i that's great if planning is operating that way but also
- it's in there yeah we ensure to have a safety in case there was conflict there so yeah no so
- this is streaming um thank you margaret i think your book anything else skipping around
- this is the use table yeah so the use table we're going to get all of these
- the links are going to be up here and then this will be the reference number so the main link to
- get to the section where all standards are for the uses that's that is happening um page 88 we
- start
- seeing some you know things that got basically relocated or alphabetized within the standards
- so there wasn't a text change if it was just moving it around um oh this is interesting
- we forgot
- 142
- we forgot to add this language in this was this is a pretty important one for
- people who own multiple lots if they can't meet their setbacks they can join those together for
- planning ends up like this and it just somehow didn't make it in here and we merged it
- adding it that back in verbatim
- these format changes chapter 18 adding definition labels we had a Scrivener's error for the eco
- set back it was it was showing up as two different things um so we went with the one that was
- actually
- intended to be so page 253 of the packet um it's 200 feet from normal elevation for like mineral
- and then something okay and here's a bigger one that i would like for you guys to be reading
- because it's relevant to the two subdivisions that you guys heard this evening we have a text
- amendment to the preservation of natural features and amenities um we just had i didn't put my eyes
- on this one good enough for the street trees but we have cleaned up the language here so that
- areas that are in more rural parts of our county are not required to put into street trees but they
- could do instead a supplemental tree preservation area on their property yeah it's what was there
- before we tried to clean up the language and then it got a little sloppy and it was unclear and
- thanks to ann for doing all our research and then residential sex accessory structure we just um
- through review of those i think we're advising they only need a plot plan not a certified plot
- plan so that's changing um we just changed two definitions that are mentioned in here the planning
- director gets mentioned in different ways throughout the ordinance so we're just including
- all of them are stated as planning director and then yeah so those are yeah this little cheat sheet
- should help if you're wanting to go through and really like look into the nitty-gritty of the
- ordinance changes that we're suggesting but the main like text amendment probably is street trees
- i would say and then adding back well impervious covers in a separate text amendment that will
- yeah yeah it's it we left it at its own thing because it might get it's a little more complex
- i want to give it some freedom to change or get delayed or rereviewed by drink where it's needed
- so yes you have the 40-foot increment increments still left on the street tree thing
- and previously we were 45 feet no it was it was well so we've always had for commercial site plans
- that are developing we've always had a 35 foot every every 35 feet for commercial development
- in the subdivision control ordinance it was 40 feet and so we brought back 40 feet from before
- because all the planners know it we just know subdivisions one tree every 40 feet okay
- i'm just bringing that up because i it's different that was my mistake of misremembering from
- yeah black committee but we talked about 35 or 40 so yeah it's in here where we did just strike
- the 35 i think where was it yeah i up here no it was not mentioned here but we can see the 40 feet
- and green yeah so that is yeah i will be more comfortable okay sorry i remember this 35 45
- about 35 40 so oh it has for both commercial and residential 40 foot yeah for subdivisions
- but commercial will remain 35 yes if they're yeah doing then the development okay yeah
- to do street dreams yeah can i kind of pose a question and i'm in my mind i'm kind of utilizing
- its administrative session for how i define those administrative sessions but on this topic because
- we discussed it briefly at black committee last week so i spent the weekend meditating on this
- a little bit is there any and you know forestry is my specialty for treats any type of trees um
- i freely think about trees often um but is there any thought from my intervention on the whole
- about
- if this concept is being had in a rural setting where we're trading one street tree for one
- preservation tree of maybe an already forest setting is there any thoughts about instead of
- going one for one and doing a square footage computation or a maybe even a decimal of an
- acreage computation where and i'm thinking from a surveyor's perspective um where instead of saying
- hey i don't want to plant 25 trees along my street side i instead let's say it's a 20th of an acre
- instead of planting 20 trees i'm preserving an acre of forest here or it's a 50th of an acre
- that's just i'm kind of i'm doing some forest inventory thoughts i'm trying to come up with how
- what would be an accurate definition for that and i just visualize from a surveyor's perspective it'd
- be easier than to you're delineating this forest pocket as opposed to going out and finding those
- particular trees and then from i think of it secondly a lot of times we see these preservation
- aspects being done on slopes and drainage concepts and i would much rather see a preservation
- of this whole drainage hole for this slope as opposed to these four trees on this slope so
- i don't know i'm kind of opening it up for discussion don't mind generally i can see what
- you're saying i think my concern with any of this whether it be one for one or for area based which
- i can see why that would make more sense is ensuring that there's some sort of conservation
- easement placed over that area but we don't we have no mechanism for checking except overhead
- right you know our our aerial photos a year later now we think the best guess is to let
- it something sure you know so that's that's the concern is that we don't lose an easement
- but i don't know how we even patrol that which i don't think and that was actually i guess i
- didn't mention that too that is a thought that i also had about from the patrolling it and i'm
- going to say you know desk chair armchair patrolling it you could patrol area via
- ortho images yeah by you know and can quickly measure and get an idea oh yeah according to
- the ortho image it looks like this canopy still exists but you can't count individual trees right
- and then beyond that you know i mean i have a section of my yard i'm only on an acre i have a
- section of the yard that's so thick with maple trees that i could consider that you know i can
- say there's 10 trees there but it's only 10 square feet you know so you know how are you defining
- the
- i'm also seeing from the environmental benefits that the street tree provides well so water aspects
- and the air quality aspects is if we put a square footage on that we're really preserving you know
- we have dense forest we have sparse forest so yeah and i'm and while i do see value in street trees
- i don't see value in street trees in rural areas because they cause you know much more
- infrastructure damage show and um you know and that's not the character i mean that's the
- primary consideration you know that my novice way of looking at it is when you're out driving in
- the
- countryside not having trees enables you to see traffic around the corner so to speak um i i don't
- think the county should be looking like a municipality with street-lined uh roadways i
- just don't know that doesn't hold true of course if there's a junkyard there or a portable toilet
- business for example you know that uh some screening needs to be done for that but street
- trees along country roads doesn't seem like that is an efficient i think it's a burden to property
- owners and to businesses but i that's just my novice way of thinking about it i like what you
- said about you know that area i know i have a big area that's undergone some radical deforestation
- because the emerald ash borer you know but still that forest area is something that i have a goal
- to repopulate but i don't have street trees you know i don't know it's the perfect because you
- brought up canopy so it's purpose so what is it the canopy i mean is it the type of tree that
- provides the canopy verse i mean i think street trees i think you know uh ornamental type trees
- right it isn't volume of the canopy that has your attention there i mean yes by larger volume
- canopies you're getting larger environmental benefits from the you know granted one of the
- biggest impacts and we talked about the briefly plat is that you know from an urban standpoint
- the street tree helps negate some of your heat sink components of the roadways and there's
- added values that we're not losing by removing them from the roadside itself
- however in the urban area i think you already have so many other you know oftentimes you already
- have
- natural tree lines being created so for me it's more of like we have this opportunity of rather
- than just not only saying 10 for 10 trees preserving and conservationally sticking to a forest
- setting
- or a group of land as opposed to just saying 10 individual trees sorry so like is it the volume
- of the canopy or is it a number of trees that are smaller that are i mean if it's about the canopy
- it's one thing it's about the root system of holding the slope there it's a different question
- which might you know indicate why we want certain trees in certain places for slope retention right
- things growing right that's what mentally i was trying to come up with what is a valuable number
- and i was doing some various i don't know if you guys are familiar with the green grid stocking
- chart but there's using basal area and comparing it to trees per acre and trying to figure out
- what is the optimal growth curve for these trees where we would sit at across the landscape on an
- average what is our optimal environmental benefit that we're yielding based on the
- acreage we're preserving in comparison to one street tree so that's where i was trying to
- but it's i also didn't want to keep going down and spend hours coming up with these numbers then
- pose it to you guys you're like now we've like one for one you know what me doing yeah thanks for
- yes i think about our storms are coming in and how many of those are lying across world roads
- tomorrow evening uh you know i um i see the point there as long as it's as long as it's easy for
- staff to calculate i think that's the key is like coming up with something that just makes sense
- that's you know in no way that property owners can understand that staff can easily you know look
- at
- an aerial and go yeah we'll call this easement whatever and you know as long as it's that i mean
- i know that it's the calculations you're thinking of are are very well thought out in terms of
- whether they contribute how do they help right but for the lay person for the resident and and even
- just for staff for being able to do this quickly we just need an easy way to translate that well
- and that's why my thought was that one if you're not you know one tree can't equal x square footage
- and that is a you know that is the variable that is put in the packet but this has to be delineated
- on the plat anyhow so the lay person is already required to be working with a surveyor unless
- there are surveyors themselves i guess that to delineate this in the plat and so in my mind this
- is also making the surveyor's job easier when we have you know whoever the surveyor sitting here
- you sell them okay well you were required to have 10 trees here but now instead you need this much
- acreage set aside that survey yeah well then kind of basing off the judgment of the room i may go
- ahead i'm sorry i may go ahead and just put some stuff that i had already started working together
- and maybe i'll try and work with tammy and we can edit the packet for two weeks from now and
- you guys can when we only so we got a published packet so okay so before the end of the week i
- will get with you tammy but uh okay but my only guidance is keep it simpler yeah don't don't make
- it so complicated now this goes hence hurting all what you're trying to explain right i i agree
- with
- what you just said and i think we had this discussion during plat and i and i fully support
- the idea of having a great conversion uh i was thinking about this over the weekend and my
- my particular property if i were to replace street trees uh they have to be on the right way which
- means it puts it in my front pastures and so every 35 to 45 feet i'd be planting a tree along there
- and you end up with what a bunch of row of trees that's going to adversely impact the growth of
- the pasture land and yet what i did long before any of this was uh i wanted to kind of uh restore
- some benefit to the areas along the west fork at clear creek where it runs the north side of my
- property so i essentially built a riparian reserve down there and planted lower growth
- canopy trees and understory trees and such and it ended up being about
- two acres out of the 17 acres total so i i get what you're saying and i think it makes perfect
- sense for people who don't necessarily want to have trees out in the front of their property
- off the right away in their in their yard or the pasture or whatever then they can dedicate a
- an aerial uh a number of uh acres or acres or whatever or units uh divisions of an acre
- that that would be a quick conversion that you could say okay this is going to be the reserve
- from now on and that could be your um your conservation set aside so to speak
- we're not not falling i will um make an appointment yeah flesh it out
- oh we finally try to find a time for that but no it's not right
- thank you edward for bringing those thoughts forward so any other questions on any of the other
- potential senior revisions just excited about that because that uh i know that some property
- owners will really burden by some of the street trees and this really goes a long way to solving
- that i think that's great i get a consensus this is for the rural areas a whole set of criteria
- still divisions if you're next to one of our greenways right and urbanizing yeah you know
- right yeah this is just rule yes so cool it's our last agenda item anything else right here
- scorch wow i know i think that's it just unless you want to like you know crash jackie's uh
- citizens academy until eight o'clock yeah it doesn't know to show up till eight o'clock that night
- he's going to show up at seven thirty and watch the highway department
- do we have a motion for adjournment
- everybody it's fine
- (orchestral music)